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 Post subject: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Fri 19, 2017 9:30 pm 
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Joined: Oct Thu 15, 2015 8:22 pm
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Location: Baltimore, MD
I'm not sure if this is in the correct forum so please move accordingly.

I have a Panasonic AN-109 9" portable tube TV from the late 60's. I just started tearing it down to begin restoration. The PC board seems to be covered with some sort of waxy sticky material. This would be bad enough but I evidently got the TV too close to my table saw and now the sticky stuff is covered with saw dust that wont vacuum off. I'm thinking about trying compressed air but wonder if the fragile parts, coils, etc., would be damaged. Any ideas here would be greatly appreciated.

Regards,
BobH


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Fri 19, 2017 9:37 pm 
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Location: Detroit, MI USA
I don't remember them being coated with anything like that. You won't hurt anything with low pressure air, but if the pressure is too strong or too close to components, there's a chance of causing damage.

You might think about using some type of spray cleaner which evaporates 100%, to wash this off with.

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Experience is what you gain when the results aren't what you were expecting.


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Fri 19, 2017 9:44 pm 
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Joined: Oct Thu 15, 2015 8:22 pm
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Location: Baltimore, MD
Dennis,

Thanks for the speedy reply. I have some "CRC QD Electronic Cleaner" from a local auto parts store that I have used to clean tuning capacitors. It does a reasonable job but it gets really cold as it evaporates and sometimes causes water condensation to form. Maybe I should give this a try.

Regards,
BobH


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Sat 20, 2017 12:43 am 
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Location: Woodinville, WA USA
Isopropyl alcohol ("rubbing alcohol") and a soft brush is pretty safe and it may be all you need. The alcohol evaporates with no residue.

Turn the circuit board on its side and let the excess drain down onto paper towels.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Sat 20, 2017 12:53 am 
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As Phil has suggested, alcohol often works. Recently, I was working on a Dynaco ST-70 board. It was covered with wax and the alcohol did not remove the wax. But what did work was lighter fluid, the universal gum remover. A trick that my Dad used often.

Of course, the usual caution is warranted due to the explosive nature of benzine or lighter fluid.

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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Sat 20, 2017 2:33 am 
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Joined: Oct Thu 15, 2015 8:22 pm
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Location: Baltimore, MD
Phil, Don,

Thanks for the replies. I have some rubbing alcohol available (70% Isopropanol) but I haven't had any lighter fluid in a while. I wonder if straight Isopropanol is available in the home improvement big box stores. I will surely check.

Thanks again,
BobH


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Sat 20, 2017 2:44 am 
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Location: Woodinville, WA USA
Try what you've got. It might work.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Sat 20, 2017 3:10 am 
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I agree, use the least aggressive cleaner first before going to stronger ones.

I have successfully used CRC automotive cleaners on home electronics, including brake cleaner, but you really have to be careful because some of the plastics in older equipment might not like them.

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Dennis

Experience is what you gain when the results aren't what you were expecting.


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Sat 20, 2017 12:45 pm 
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Joined: Apr Sat 06, 2013 2:18 pm
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Location: New Hampshire
For alcohol 91% isopropyl is best & dirt cheap at any drug store.
A lot of vert output transformers went in those sets & put
out wax but not a lot. Must have been something in the air.
You can often tell what room a set was in by the type of
crud in it.

73 Zeno
LFOD !


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Sat 20, 2017 1:47 pm 
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Location: Fernandina Beach, FL
philsoldradios wrote:
Try what you've got. It might work.

Mr. Detrola wrote:
I agree, use the least aggressive cleaner first before going to stronger ones.
I have successfully used CRC automotive cleaners on home electronics, including brake cleaner, but you really have to be careful because some of the plastics in older equipment might not like them.

Certainly, I would start easy and see where it goes.

I tried to warm a jar candle so that I could dump the wax out and recycle the jar. The candle had some water in the bottom and the steam exploded in the microwave. Candle wax all over the interior. It took two hours to clean. But 90% isopropanol alcohol was able to slowly dissolve it.

However... on my Dynakit ST-70 circuit board which appeared to be covered in bees wax, the alcohol would not touch it. Lighter fluid was the only thing that even began to dissolve it. And, it took quite some time. The lighter fluid did not remove the markings from the board or the stripes on the resistors. So, I was lucky.

Try the easy ones first. For sure, water won't remove the wax!

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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Thu 25, 2017 2:29 am 
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Location: Redlands CA
Cleaning circuit boards with soap (something like 409) and hot water isn't out of the question, I've done it lots of times and newer stuff is actually safer to do than the older stuff because it's mostly plastic parts, coil forms, capacitors and so forth, just keep it out of items like enclosed transformers and other places the water can get trapped.

Example, 1966 Airline B&W set, set still worked fine after.

Before
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After
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chassisclean.jpg [ 24.04 KiB | Viewed 1200 times ]


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: May Mon 29, 2017 11:38 pm 
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Joined: Oct Thu 15, 2015 8:22 pm
Posts: 62
Location: Baltimore, MD
Gents,
Sorry for the late reply. I was out of town on vacation for a week.

Thanks for all the great suggestions. I'll start trying to clean the PCB this week and report my progress.

Regards,
BobH


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: Jun Sat 03, 2017 7:46 pm 
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Joined: Oct Thu 15, 2015 8:22 pm
Posts: 62
Location: Baltimore, MD
Eric H,
I tried a 409 spray and soak followed by a hot water spray. It worked like a champ. When the board dried I could read all of the board markings and component values. I'll let it dry for a week or more before I apply any power.

Zeno,
Boy you called this one right on. The waxy substance I thought was everywhere was only in about a 3 inch diameter around the vertical output transformer. I'll have to check this area out carefully.

Thanks for the good tips and info.

Regards,
BobH


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 Post subject: Re: Panasonic AN-109 TV
PostPosted: Jun Wed 07, 2017 6:54 pm 
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Joined: Oct Thu 15, 2015 8:22 pm
Posts: 62
Location: Baltimore, MD
I put this set back together yesterday. This morning I did a visual inspection and ohmed out the low voltage power supply circuitry. Since I don't have a variac I brought it up slowly with a dim bulb setup.

Once I got it up to full line voltage I was pretty happy with how well it worked. Good audio, brightness and contrast, horizontal and vertical hold. After it heated up a bit I noticed that the vertical size had slight erratic size changes that are enough to be annoying. They seem to be completely random. I'll be checking the vertical output transformer since it has leaked some wax and its associated circuitry.

Also, I plan to recap the electrolytics eventually.

Regards,
BobH


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