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My CCradio LCD and/or Audio Fix...
Audio Fix: Replaced Capacitor C61 and/or other Capacitor(s).  0%  [ 0 ]
Audio Fix: Using External Speaker/Ear/Headphones.  0%  [ 0 ]
Audio Fix: Repairing or Replacing Headphone Jack.  0%  [ 0 ]
Audio Fix: Bypassing Headphone Jack with a Jumper Wire.  0%  [ 0 ]
Audio Fix: Replacing Other Component.  0%  [ 0 ]
LCD Fix: Mounted Device to Apply Pressure on Ribbon Cable.  0%  [ 0 ]
LCD Fix: ReHeat Method was Temporary.  0%  [ 0 ]
LCD Fix: ReHeat Method seems to be a Permanent Fix.  0%  [ 0 ]
LCD Fix: Replaced LCD.  0%  [ 0 ]
LCD Fix: Used Conductive Ink/Glue/Paint.  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 0
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 Post subject: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:45 am 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
Over the recent months, I started to lose segments on my CCradio's LCD.

I looked-up the LCD problem again with these cCrane radios, and found
my way here. (Dead YaHoo Group.)

I saw a YouTube video on the 'hair dryer' fix for the ribbon cable.

Along with my audio dropping out, and the buttons getting harder and
harder to work, I was about to do the 'heat gun' gun method, but given
the above mentioned additional problems along with nearly all LCD
segments gone, I saw Capacitor C61 had a slight bulge on top.

A classic sign of a weak, leaky cap. I had a Radio Shack pack of caps
that I bought decades ago, and found a 1,000 uF cap, except it was huge.

It won't fit at location C61. So, I soldered extension wires to the
BIG cap and laid it on its side (with foam tape) in the space near the
volume pot.

I then reassembled the the radio. Powered it up with batteries...
Yes! I have the LCD display working again!

I believe the reheating and other methods of the carbon-printed ribbon
cable was just lowering the resistance a bit to allow it to work, but
real source of the problem, for me at least, was the leaky cap (C61).


Upon powering up the radio, there was no audio. Later, I plugged-in an
extension speaker... and the audio has been working for over 24 hours
straight. I believe that ear/external speaker jack is the 'audio
drop-out' problem.

I'll have to open the radio again to deal with the jack some time later.

Also, my earlier purchase before the Platinum Edition, was the Black Mica
version. I don't remember if the LCD was going bad, but the top buttons
were getting real hard to work correctly. I'll have to dig that one
out of storage (and buy more caps). ( See the CAP-Gate Story at
the BadCaps site), on why a lot of power supply and other failures in many
electronics over the many years.)

I have Pics.



- Pj


Attachments:
File comment: Let's See What's Inside...
2016 10 01 [Let The Project Begin - CCradio Platinum Edition] [800x800 or Less].jpg
2016 10 01 [Let The Project Begin - CCradio Platinum Edition] [800x800 or Less].jpg [ 80.62 KiB | Viewed 2097 times ]
File comment: There it is... The Carbon-Printed LCD Ribbon Cable.
2016 10 01 [The Ribbon Cable from the LCD] a [800x800 or Less].jpg
2016 10 01 [The Ribbon Cable from the LCD] a [800x800 or Less].jpg [ 70.61 KiB | Viewed 2097 times ]
File comment: How Sweet! cCrane Left Some Candy Behind!
2016 10 01 [The Ribbon Cable from the LCD] c [800x800 or Less].jpg
2016 10 01 [The Ribbon Cable from the LCD] c [800x800 or Less].jpg [ 92.41 KiB | Viewed 2097 times ]
File comment: Hold On! Put The Heat Gun Down. What Have We Here? A Bad, Leaky Cap! Let's Extract This Dude.
2016 10 01 [The Bad, Leaky 1,000uF Cap].jpg
2016 10 01 [The Bad, Leaky 1,000uF Cap].jpg [ 71.37 KiB | Viewed 2097 times ]
File comment: Bulged Top. Debris Leaking Around The Outer Cover. Sorry, Bud... You're Not Going Back in... Your Service Days are Over.
2016 10 01 [The Bad, Leaky Cap] [800x800 or Less].jpg
2016 10 01 [The Bad, Leaky Cap] [800x800 or Less].jpg [ 54.24 KiB | Viewed 2097 times ]
File comment: My Only Spare Cap at This Value... is Oversized. Make it Fit!
2016 10 01 [Over-Sized Cap Installed] [800x800 or Less].jpg
2016 10 01 [Over-Sized Cap Installed] [800x800 or Less].jpg [ 72.69 KiB | Viewed 2097 times ]
File comment: C61 Location, Near the Ear/Headphone Jack.
2016 10 01 Leads from [Over-Sized Cap Installation] [800x800 or Less].jpg
2016 10 01 Leads from [Over-Sized Cap Installation] [800x800 or Less].jpg [ 104.35 KiB | Viewed 2097 times ]


Last edited by PjInOhio on Oct Fri 14, 2016 9:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Fri 07, 2016 7:31 am 
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Joined: Sep Wed 03, 2014 3:08 am
Posts: 592
Location: Central Pennsylvania, USA
Welcome to the forum,

Sangean multiband front ends have two FET's in the circuit, should AM/SW (all bands) sensitivity drop off, plan on changing the pair of transistors, they are notorious for failing due to ESD being dissipated into the radio when external antennas are connected in any way to the radio's telescopic antenna. On models featuring an external antenna jack, ensure that the static is discharged prior to connecting it to the radio.

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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Fri 07, 2016 8:12 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 1431
Location: Watsonville, CA, US
i went through two CC 2E radios. They both died of manufacturing defects. I got the first one replaced under warentee. The second one, they would not replace. As I recall the earphone jack broke and the LCDs on both died. They do not seem to be high quality at all. You have my respect for having the patience to fix one. I simply spiked the second one in the trash can and declared victory.

At $160 I expect much more. They were not even 1/10th the radio my $30 Halicrafter S-20 is. I don't know if the speaks highly of my 80 year old tube radio or poorly of today's products. Maybe both?


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Fri 07, 2016 9:41 pm 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
Wow. Sorry to hear that.

I've seen the posts on the InterNet over the years about these CCRadios, but didn't realize the
issues with the caps (BadCaps site) until years later after I got my two CCRadios.

I had to get a cap replacement kit (Amazon) to fix the Power Supply of a plasma Vizio TV (VP322).

I got a dead 19" Philips TV which is populated with one of the bad brand-name caps -
and replaced the video and PS boards twice already!

I have DigitalStream Cable box that's bad. I wrote-down the cap values for a future fix-it project.

I should be able to revive the Black Mica CCRadio, whenever I get around to ordering new caps.

I've had the Platinum on continuously since Saturday evening, and so far, the display is still working
and the audio it still working - with the external speaker. I may open up the jack and clean it up
or just end up bypassing it by soldering a jumper on the circuit board. :D

I was quite surprised the jack had gone bad, since I never really used it in all these years. I can't
help wonder if it's just oxidation or what, but poor quality and/or design, I say.



-Pj


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Fri 07, 2016 9:57 pm 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
AMStationEngineer wrote:

Welcome to the forum,

Sangean multiband front ends have two FET's in the circuit, should AM/SW (all bands) sensitivity drop off,
plan on changing the pair of transistors, they are notorious for failing due to ESD being dissipated into
the radio when external antennas are connected in any way to the radio's telescopic antenna.

On models featuring an external antenna jack, ensure that the static is discharged prior to connecting it to the radio.




Thanks.

I'll take note of that. Where are these 'FETs' located?
Sangean didn't put in a fuse or other protection for this?
Wow. Cheap omission.

I believe I hooked up something externally a few times long ago.
Other than that, just the telescopic antenna.

I'm not an electronics expert. I know only enough to be dangerous. :D

I never finished my 'Heath Kit' test. (Oooh. Math? Formulas?) ;D



-Pj

_________________
- Pj

(I only know enough to be dangerous when fixing things.)

:D;=:


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Fri 07, 2016 11:28 pm 
Member

Joined: Aug Wed 24, 2011 4:35 am
Posts: 3688
Location: Sunnyvale CA
PjInOhio wrote:
I'll take note of that. Where are these 'FETs' located?
Sangean didn't put in a fuse or other protection for this?
Wow. Cheap omission.


You can't use a fuse - the current for a sufficient ESD event is far smaller than the operating current. It takes very little current to damage the transistors.

Brett


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Sat 08, 2016 12:49 am 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
Update:

I inquired to cCrane about the CCRadios and got a reply back from a Product Specialist
(who also read the previous posts here).

He said he was surprised that the LCD was working again, and it was by chance. The
cap I replaced is in the audio circuit, and has nothing to do with the LCD. :cry:

I have to admit, I rubbed a little bit at the Ribbon Cable, but did not do any heat
method. It was obviously enough to get the Display to work for now.

Also, just before I checked my eMail and saw his reply, I checked the LCD again, and
Oh-No! :shock: Segments are starting to fade a bit. (Sigh)

Well, I'm wondering if I devise some method to keep pressure on the cable that this
would be enough to keep it working?

Back to the 'drawing board'. :roll:


- Pj (See, I Only Know Enough to be Dangerous.) :mrgreen:



.


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Sat 08, 2016 7:23 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 24540
Location: SoCal, 91387
I have a CCrane "CCRadioSW" sitting on the edge of my desk. I like it's styling, switchable wide and narrow IF's, and the tone from it's speaker, but I don't use it very often.

The reason being that performance wise, it lags behind my Panasonic RF 3100, GE SR-2 and P-780, and can't even be in the same sentence when mentioning my Sony ICF-2010.

The build quality is obviously mediocre, and below that of the other aforementioned sets. I only consider it as a back-up radio.

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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Sat 08, 2016 7:36 pm 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
fifties wrote:
GE SR-2



When I got the CCRadios and compared them to my GE Super Radios (I and II), the reception
was essentially the same, except with nighttime deep fades, the CCRadios intelligibility was
a bit better.



- Pj

.


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Sun 09, 2016 8:07 pm 
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Joined: Sep Wed 03, 2014 3:08 am
Posts: 592
Location: Central Pennsylvania, USA
PJ,

Both FET's were of the TO-92 style molded housing, and were located next to the "External Antenna" (sub-miniature headphone jack).

My son has one, and it finally got to the point, after having to install the second set, that I installed transistor sockets to avoid damage to the printed circuit board. Note: This was a late '90s manufactured radio, and the latest model which I've worked on would be circa 2005. The designs have probably changed since, however, one owner told me that he shorts the jack for his external antenna (50-ft dipole, RG-174-U at the jack, adapted to RG-8-U, which feeds from the balun) with a piece of aluminum foil - when not in use.

Best,

Tim

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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Sun 09, 2016 9:47 pm 
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Joined: Sep Wed 03, 2014 3:08 am
Posts: 592
Location: Central Pennsylvania, USA
PJ,

The link to this ARF thread should answer quite a few questions: http://www.antiqueradios.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=256882

With regards to the display, the "ribbon cable" appears to an item/component referred to as a "FLEX". They were, and to some degree still are used when connecting LCD screens, and segmented LCD's to their switching source for conventional and "back-lit" LCD displays in avionics and other electronic items requiring visual interface other than simple go/no-go indication.

My guess is that there may be intermittent bonding within the connection area of the LCD, and manipulation took care of the incomplete connection. Application of either heat: (heat gun, and ONLY at the connection point with the LCD itself, and be darn careful - or the LCD will blow), or cold: (freeze mist, and ONLY at the connection point with the LCD itself, and be darn careful - or the LCD will blow).

Another possibility is that the connection between the flex itself, and the PC Board is faulty (contaminated or broken). Denatured ethyl alcohol is an effective cleaning agent for this purpose.

Not identical, but may point you in the right direction:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2pf8iUgqqQ

Best,

Tim

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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Mon 10, 2016 11:41 pm 
Member

Joined: May Sat 12, 2012 1:33 pm
Posts: 1266
Location: Rochester, NY.
I also have the CCraneSW. It is going on 11 years old now. I have had fractured solder joints on the main board that caused fading display and reset the clock.
I also had to replace the volume control that would blast full volume if it was in the right spot. The resistance material was falling off the shoe.
It has gone camping with me although it is not an outdoor radio. The built in charger is nice. The twin-ferrite (Justice antenna) does noticeably reduce fade. The illuminated large display numerals are easy to see at night with my old eyes.
Fidelity is very good. It does have images, but it seems to get better with less antenna.
So far the caps have held up.
It is made by Redsun (similar to their RP2100). It is under other names like Kaito KA2100, Roadstar TRA-2350, Elta Globestar 3569 and a few others. All these Chinese radios look very similar inside and out.


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Tue 11, 2016 1:34 am 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
AMStationEngineer wrote:
PJ,

With regards to the display, the "ribbon cable"...

...A possibility is that the connection between the
flex itself, and the PC Board is faulty (contaminated or broken).


Best,

- Tim



Thanks, Tim.

Yes, my understanding that this is the case from hearing/reading about this over the years - The contact with the carbon from the ribbon cable to the copper pads on the board eventually become compromised.

The video link you provided deals with copper. These 'carbon-printed' cables I don't think can be soldered, so I put in an order for 'conductive paint'. The description says it's good for 'carbon buttons' in remote controls, so I can also repair some old remotes that I still use. :D

What I could do, is scrape the ribbon coating away from each trace to expose the carbon on top. Then, I could 'paint' on top of the exposed carbon and lay a track over to the copper trace on the board. Or lift just the very edge of the cable and put some conductive paint under there.

What do think? Will it work?

I see the few segments that started to fade days ago are back - for now.

Perhaps if I rigged up some sort of item to have constant pressure across the ribbon cable could all be that is needed?



- Pj

.


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Tue 11, 2016 5:42 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 5621
Location: Black Hills, SD 57745
I bought a "pen" of conductive paint made by Caig. Twenny five bucks! :shock:

Image

I tried it to repair a membrane keyboard for a Timex TS1500 that already had a botched-up rewire attempt: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=302550&start=31 and a little further on in the thread I give a quickie review of the Caig pen I bought: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=302550&start=54 (Hmm, it seems I've forgotten some of the messy details of using my sample, which was probably old stock.)

I'd already replaced the membrane with new, I mostly wanted to try out the pen with restoring continuity across breaks. That's a more radical repair than just restoring old, oxidized pressure contacts, but what I learned might help.

Make sure the stuff is well-mixed and allow it to dry thoroughly for best results. It stayed soft quite awhile, overnight or a full day to dry would be recommended. Apply a small spot of it on a similar substrate to use as a guinea pig to check for dryness and conductivity.

I did get some "good" spots that were readable for continuity along the conductive trace, but I rushed the process and played with it too soon. (And the pen didn't work.)

I've had success with adding a pressure pad to weak ribbon contacts, but it takes some fiddling to get enough in the right spot. There's a tough, but squishy variation that looks like styrofoam but is open-cell. It's often used as padding blocks in the packaging of a lot of consumer electronics. Cuts precisely with a sharp knife and has more oomph than foam weatherstripping, for example. There's stiffer black-foam versions of weatherstripping as well. Even stacked bits of electrical tape if the space is small.

-Ed


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Fri 14, 2016 2:44 am 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
Ed in SoDak wrote:

I bought a "pen" of conductive paint made by Caig.

Twenny five bucks! :shock:

I've had success with adding a pressure pad to weak
ribbon contacts, but it takes some fiddling to get
enough in the right spot.

There's a tough, but squishy variation that looks like
Styrofoam but is open-cell.


-Ed




Yeah, I looked at the different pens, but saw the jar of 'glue' and ordered that ($9 shipped).

Should be here Friday or Monday.

(CCRadio LCD: All the segments still working.)




- Pj


.


Attachments:
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar.jpg
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar.jpg [ 6.83 KiB | Viewed 1895 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Fri 14, 2016 7:02 pm 
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Posts: 592
Location: Central Pennsylvania, USA
You may want to figure a way to use "silk screen mesh" for application of the conductive glue.
Some conductive coatings require heat, and even humidified heat for complete curing; be cautious....

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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Fri 14, 2016 10:01 pm 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
I re-did the CCRadio LCD/Audio Fix Poll, located above the first post in this Subject Thread.


- Pj


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Sat 15, 2016 7:27 pm 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
Conductive Glue arrived yesterday.

I'll do some testing with the 'goo' before I attempt the Ribbon Cable 'fix'.

Here's some pics of the 'LCD', still working for now, and the 'goo'...


Attachments:
2016 10 15  [CCRadio LCD].jpg
2016 10 15 [CCRadio LCD].jpg [ 79.33 KiB | Viewed 1850 times ]
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar b.jpg
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar b.jpg [ 77.02 KiB | Viewed 1850 times ]
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar c.jpg
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar c.jpg [ 82.67 KiB | Viewed 1850 times ]
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar d.jpg
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar d.jpg [ 94.88 KiB | Viewed 1850 times ]
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar e.jpg
Conductive Ink-Glue in Jar e.jpg [ 61.53 KiB | Viewed 1850 times ]

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(I only know enough to be dangerous when fixing things.)

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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Sun 16, 2016 8:46 am 
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Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
Conductive Glue Instructions Print-out:

The print-out that came in the mailer along with the glue
was grammatically a mess, so I put together my own version of it:



Instructions:


Make sure areas to be electrically connected are clean. Use
Rubbing Alcohol, for example. Have good contact by removing
any corrosion, insulation, or solder that may block direct
metal contact. Any solder must first be removed.

If joining wires, strip any insulation and twist the wires
together with five or more turns for good mechanical support.



Allow Proper Drying Before Use:

It takes 24 hours before the bond holds with strength and to
become electrically highly conductive, so you might need to
mechanically secure a connection as the Glue dries and cures.

Shake jar and then open and stir vigorously and thoroughly the
fluid before every use, including any content that may have
settled to the bottom of the jar.

The glue is water soluble until dried.

Glue Becomes Thick: Thin the glue with water if evaporation
has taken place during storage.

After use, keep jar tightly closed.



When fully dried and cured, if a stronger, more robust bond is
needed for better mechanical strength and if the bond will be
subjected to flexing or vibration, overcoat the joint with epoxy,
Super Glue, or similar cement glue.

Using as little as possible, apply the Conductive Glue with a
toothpick or a brush. Allow 24 hours for drying and hardening.



Curing and Bonding Time: The glue cures with the evaporation
of the water solvent. For the shortest curing time, use the
minimum necessary. Large blobs will take longer to dry.

Keypads and Remote Controls: This glue will restore
conductivity to the worn-off carbon on the soft buttons.
You will have to take apart the remote to have access to
the carbon button overlay that sits atop the remote or
keypad circuit board.

Brush-on the glue to each defective contact button and allow
24 hours to fully dry.



EMI RF Shielding:

This glue is suitable for pickup cavities, control cavities,
cavity covers, and other smaller areas. Use proper grounding
if needed.

To shield guitars or other RF shielding:

Apply at least three coats of glue to a clean and dry surface.
Allow 24 hours of drying between each coat.
Use a good hair-bristle paint brush to apply.



_________________
- Pj

(I only know enough to be dangerous when fixing things.)

:D;=:


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 Post subject: Re: CCradio (Dec 2002) LCD and Audio Drop Fix
PostPosted: Oct Mon 24, 2016 1:36 am 
New Member

Joined: Oct Fri 07, 2016 5:06 am
Posts: 13
Location: Ohio
Last night's colder temps had some of the LCD segments fading again.

I think I'll try some tests with this glue and try it out on a remote control
I have that has problem buttons. Plus, I have this other remote from a
Philips DVR that has all-but-dead buttons on it. I have a spare remote
for that and have been using it for several years now
.



.

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- Pj

(I only know enough to be dangerous when fixing things.)

:D;=:


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