Underrated would have to be the Fisher 202 Futura Series receiver. Only 25 WPC but when working properly sounds truly wonderful.

Another underrated brand IMHO would have to be Lafayette. I have a LT-50/KT-500 AM-FM tuner that is an excellent performer. Also I had at one time a Lafayette la-424 amp and the matching tuner. The amp until it blew an output transistor worked very good and sounded great. The tuner did not wok so good, but both had the original electrolytics installed which is prob why tuner didn't work good.

Its pretty hard to bash an entire line of anything or praise an entire line.

As for the Marantz SS stuff if any of you are talking about post 1980 marantz you will find it is cheapo components unless you look to the Esotec line. Pre 1980 Marantz stuff seems to be pretty good. My 300DC drives my 6 Ohm FRS-15s without issue.

I've admired the build quality of the higher end Kenwood SS stuff but I haven't had the opportunity to own any but A mid level Kenwood C2 amp. I def think that one is under-rated.

I'll probably take flack for this but what do I find over rated? Those Magnavox EL-84 console amps. They sound good for what they're intended purpose was but removed from their original system and touted as a hi quality power amp? Ive tried them and found them pretty bad. They are worth the $40 to $75 you can get the whole consoles for but not prices they are selling for on ebay IMHO.

Steve

Not to be sassy but the topic included amplifiers and Peavy and Acoustic made amplifiers. Guitar amps came into the discussion a few frames earlier.

Only firsthand experience with Yamaha is a keyboard. Well finished and well functional, can't judge audio quality, not even being a keyboardist.

We had a 'Beatle band' in the mid 60s that was all Vox. As long as you stayed away from the SS ones they were pretty kickarse.

The Magnavox console amps are good once you replace the output transformers with transformers that have better frequency response and remove any EQ from the feedback circuitry. Do that and they sound amazing with the right speakers. To see what I mean use a scope on the output and watch the sinewave you input start getting distorted around 60 Hz with stock output transformers.

I do agree they sell for entirely too much on Ebay. People are just paying for the name as any SEP 6BQ5 amp with the mods I discribed will sound just the same as the Magnavox does.

I've issued this challenge to many local sound-people around here, and never had anyone willing to take me up on it.

Gimme a box-truck full of old-school (the ones with the cast aluminum faceplates) Peavey amps, mixers, and processors... and a bunch of the SP1, SP2s, SP3s, and 118 subs. I'll configure that into a system that will sound better than 90% of all clubs in any town. If I am allowed to update the speakers with modern horn diaphragms (22XT diaphragms, instead of the 22A), use Peavey ST94 supertweeters, incorporate Low-Rider 18"s in the subs (retuning the port to work with the new woofer), and use some simple modern signal processing (a single DBX DriveRack would be fine) I'd up that to 95% of all clubs.

A good workman doesn't blame his tools...

IMHO, Crown PA equipment is as overrated, as Peavey is under-rated. I have yet to see an original-generation Peavey CS800 that couldn't be made to work properly. In essence... the Peavey CS800 IS a BGW 750, with different cosmetics. I've had both apart on the bench at the same time, so I KNOW of what I speak here...

Compare that to the legions of dead Crown CE1000, CE2000 and CE4000 amps that NOBODY can fix (holes burnt through carbonized circuit boards, due to unstable design)...

Regards,
Gordon.

To each their own, I guess.

I will say this, though: I've taken the 6V6 version (the Magnavox AMP175 series), updated it with new caps, removed any built-in EQ, and installed proper input and output jacks... and A/B compared it with a $1500 Audio Research amp. Within their power (the Magnavox is 15 watts, while the ARC was 60 watts), some of the listeners thought the Magnavox sounded BETTER than the ARC... better bass control, better soundstaging and imaging. And this was on first-class speakers, too (Tannoy Prestige Glenairs and Boston Acoustics VR3s)...

Regards,
Gordon.

Tuberadio,
I'm sure they sound much better with replacement ouput transformers as that is really their weak point.

Gordon
I've never had one of the 6v6 amps wich is why I said el84 but i'm guessing they are very similar. My testing was comparing a 299 7189a scott to a el84 maggie. With the tone controls all set flat on the 299 and driving both with an ipod into small JBL speakers it wasn't even close. Both amps were rebuilt and those tinny output transformers just could not cope with the JBL speakers. The scott was on a whole other level. Granted the scott will sell for quite a bit more than the Maggie but the difference was so dramatic that I would just recommend folks save their pennies for an amp that has some decent iron on it. Or if you can score one cheap enough replace the iron as tuberadio recommends. There are some decent console amps out there the seem to have some nice iron on them like a fisher.

I recently had a Motorola el84 console amp but didn't get a chance to listen to it much or do any direct comparisons but it did seem to do a decent job and seemed to have a bit better transformers on it.

Magnavox's claim to fame at that time was matching components together for good sounding system at a much lower price point than you could put one together. So the amps were designed to only drive the speaker systems that came with the system. The efficiency of the Tannoys you mention are probably close to the originals which could account for the results you achieved.

Steve

Most overrated.....the original Acoustic Research amplifier. I loved the minimalist styling but mine never sounded all that hot. It went out in a blaze of glory one night when it caught fire. I guess not too many have survived for a reason. They should have stuck to making speakers and turntables.

I think the Magnavox 6V6 P-P amps like the 8802 series are under rated. For a simple amp and paired with decent speakers I think they sound pretty good. I have one connected to an old pair of JBL L-110 speakers and for the money I like it. If you consider bang for the buck, I like these simple amps. Especially if you redo the bias so each pair of output tubes uses it's own bias resistor instead of all 4 output tubes using one resistor. But that's just me. For SS amps the best one I had was an early '70s Pioneer Spec 1 preamp and Spec 2 amp. 325W into 4 ohms or 250 into 8 ohms. For overrated I don't know as I never had that much disposable cash to find out. Good thread.

Doug

Yes and also if the Maggie amp uses a balance control on the amp disable it by using two resistors in the circuit that are half the total resistance of the balance control and put them in series with the cathode bias resistors.

Radio Shack, Lafayette, Olson ( remember them?)Sanyo, Pilot, Jc Penny, , Symphonic, DAK ( Drew sent me) VM, and Craig made absolutely great sounding Amps. I KNOW!! Julian Hirsch ( God rest his soul ) told me so. Stereophile and I had great regard for "The Tice Clock" The Absolute Sound turned me on to GenTech speaker cable ( $35.00 a foot but with free shipping). Ok gotta go, my Yugo needs a tuneup!

I think maybe your ears could use a tuneup as well

I don't think Mark was being 'literal'. Any more than those magazines were being objective.

I knew that

Now, who wants to buy some chemically-treated tube dampers?

My audio bud and I (worked at same shop) used to LOAO over Absolute Sound.

Gives me a great marketing idea. Earthquake prevention pills. For $3 a day, you take them and they are guaranteed to prevent earthquake damage or we refund your last purchase.

I like it!

M-u-u-u-u-a-a-a-h-h! Wanna buy some? I'll give you an insider discount. Even if you live smack on top of the San Andreas.

Got another one. Alligator repellant pills in Florida. More like $6 a day.

How dare you say I need my ears turniped? Ill have you know I've read every audio review ever published in Mechanics Illustrated! Oh and by the way I'll put my Lafayette Minuette speakers up against any you may own any day! I'm off to listin to my Arvin radio Goodbye!!

Laughing Yet speakers?

Arvin? Like, Arvin and the Chipmunks?

Here is a photo of my Arvin radio. Many a warm day here in Barrow Alaska I have spent the afternoon dx ing as I look upon the near shores of Russia from my bathroom window. Last month I was able to get Ganymede shortly after midnight. You think I'm asking too much???? Notice shipping by dog sled is free but absolutely NO RETURNS!!! http://cgi.ebay.com/Hopalong-Cassidy-Ra ... 701wt_1163