Hey everyone,

I have the opportunity to buy this TV for about $30 or $35. The ad says it doesn't work, but the owner heard it needs a tube replaced but "has done nothing for fear of doing damage". Of course this can be any number of problems, I know, but I don't mind a good project. This would be my first TV (I've electrically restored several tube radios). From what I've found, it is from 1958 and the ad said it's RCA, but that's all I know. I expect that by '58 black and white TV was pretty much perfected, so this would be a good watchable set when restored? Here is a picture. Any thoughts / info / comments are appreciated. Thanks!

The price isn't bad if you like the set. However, you should first test the CRT with a CRT checker to be 100% certain it is good enough to use. This is not a rare or valuable set, and you would not want to have to purchase a CRT for it should you find out it is bad.

They do work well when everything is right. But this set has printed circuit boards and can be a bit annoying to work on, although nowhere near as bad as some others of around the same age. Main problems with them were yokes, power transformers, tuner failures, and leaky capacitors.

Of course replacing all the paper and electrolytic caps is a given......we were doing that in the shop when these sets were about 10 years old.

Note some visible damage on the finish on the top of this set. This particular type of finish is extremely difficult to redo and have it look decent, so take that into consideration as well.

It is common for people who are trying to sell old TVs (and radios) to say that they think that it needs a tube. And it is possible that a tube failure is indeed the reason that people stopped using the set. But the fact that it is not color is also a very likely reason. In any case, you should count on having to replace all of the paper caps and the electrolytics. Unfortunately you will have to take a chance on the condition of the CRT. But at that price, you will have not put a lot of money into it and replacement CRTs can usually be found.

Edit: Ah, posting at the same time as Mr Detrola!

Of course I plan on replacing all the paper and electrolytic capacitors, I won't even try to start it until the electrolytic caps in the power supply are replaced. Unfortunately I don't have a CRT tester, but for $30 I'm willing to take a chance, especially since I really like way this TV looks. But I have heard that some TV's like the Predicta and the old porthole TV's are famous for always having problems, I just wanted to make sure that this wasn't one of those notoriously problematic TV's Maybe I should add that I'm just turning 19, so I'm not super experienced with these old electronics, but I have common sense and know the basics of what needs to be done to these and how to be safe while working on them.

Here is one about a year newer that I have, the mask looks the same so probably the same crt, same size anyway. Actually I watch this set more than my others. Great picture and it works well.

Good luck with yours, if you get it. Nice to hear someone so young is getting involved with
these. Sounds like you are a level headed lad, just beware of the HV. It can give you a
pretty darn good jolt. Don't forget to discharge it either when testing. Some caps can hold a good charge quite a while. Again, good luck to you.

If you're comfortable with recapping and don't mind risking $35, that set should be enjoyable to watch when restored.

I'm not familiar with that model, but here's an article about restoring a 1958 Philco that might be helpful in a very general way:

http://antiqueradio.org/PhilcoF4626MTelevision.htm

My Philco also had printed circuit boards. If you're lucky, your flyback will be better than mine was.

Late-1950s TVs don't have the historical interest of the 1940s sets, but there's a lot to be said for a big 21-inch screen. And as you said, manufacturers had pretty much figured out how to design a good-performing B/W television by then.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

Thanks for all the quick replies

Phil - You have an amazing website, it actually helped me learn most of what I know about these old radios and TVs. I've read pretty much every restoration article on there, it's great to see how these old sets get restored after years of sitting somewhere in an attic or basement.

I think I've pretty much decided that I'm gonna buy this TV, if I can

sure go for it. FYI B&W crts that test weak can still make a decent pic so chances are you will at least be able to get something on it. As far as the PCB's I actually prefer them IF they are easy to get at (some have soldered in shields or worse mounted in chassis that blocks the bottoms). If the PCB bottom is exposed it makes it easy to work on. I like solder wick when the leads are bent over the traces or a intergrated iron/sucker on boards that do not bend the leads over (thru plated). Use a good heat controlled soldering iron and flux the wick before using. Hopefully that era set will not have any paper caps except prob the across the line ceramic tube cap and maybe some other HV ceramic tube caps in the primary of the vert out transformer and audio out transformer. Maybe a bumble bee in that across the line or chassis to line. If you have a metered variac then you can give it a try to see if the filter caps are ok (I generally pull the HOT and the VOT for low voltage startups). If it uses SS rectifiers in the B+ then you can start real low and check the current and voltage of the B+ to see how its doing. OR you could just assume the electrolyitics are bad and replace before doing any thing, but I have found that they are often ok, esp if you do the slow startup. One last thing do the set a favor and keep the line voltage to around 115vac (after you get it going) I suspect a lot of the hot flybacks that so many of these old sets get is do to line voltage often in the 125vac range.

I fixed up an RCA about that age and remember it as being pretty straightforward. If it is like mine, the chassis is upright and wraps around the crt. Most of the time, on these, they just need caps and some minor tweaking, maybe replace a couple weak tubes to optimize performance.

UPDATE:

I emailed the seller today, and found out some more info. Apparently it's an RCA 21-T-8467 with a 21 inch screen. It also has the correct back, and the back is completely flat (no protruding CRT neck). If all goes as planned I should get it this weekend.

Good for you. Keep us updated.

Nice to see younger folks getting into this hobby - especially one who has already recapped tube radios.


Carl

Yes, you can buy that TV because it classic TV and BTW, its functioning so it doesn't hurt your budget. best of luck.

Personally, I like that set and I'd probably go for it if it were in my area. Of course, I'd feel better about it if I could pull the back and test the CRT before buying; but, that is not always practical. There's a good chance the tube is weak; but, I've seen these old CRT's read down in the BAD range on the tester and still make a watchable picture. If they are too bad, they will usually rejuvenate well with a more modern CRT tester. I've had luck bringing back some CRT's by bumping the filament voltage from 6.3V to around 8V and letting the tube "cook" for a few hours. Sometimes, a tube will lose emission from sitting unused for decades and "cooking" it is often all that's needed to bring it back.

I have a 17" RCA from '57 that I got, last year, from a dealer who had gone out of business. It was in a pile of old TV that the dealer took in on trade towards a new TV and I'd guess that set had not seen AC since the early '70's, at the latest. Looking at the inside, that set had seen a lot of time on the repair bench. The yoke had been replaced, many tubes had been replaced, many caps had been replaced, and many resistors had been replaced. This TV uses several PC board assemblies that are soldered to the main chassis frame and it was necessary to unsolder each board from the chassis in order to gain access to the back side of the board. The previous technician simply clipped the old part off on top of the board and soldered the new part to the remaining wire studs from the old part. While this is the quickest way to make the repair, it looks rather sloppy and I decided to do it the "right" way. After replacing all paper and electrolytic caps, the selenium rectifiers, and cleaning the controls; the set worked fairly well. The biggest problem with it now is that the yoke cover is falling apart and the yoke will not stay secure on the CRT neck.

When you get your set, you really need to have the CRT tested. If it turns out to be dead and can't be salvaged; then, there is no need to overhaul the chassis until you find a CRT. Believe me, I've "been there, done that" on repairing a TV chassis only to find out that the tube is either dead or near dead. On any TV I service, new or old, I perform a test of the CRT before doing anything else.

If the CRT is OK, I eyeball the whole chassis for any signs of hack repairs or possible damage to major organs.

Then, I'll slowly power up the set with a variac and watch the current draw. This will give me an idea as to what kind of shape the chassis is in before I undertake a recap job. Sometimes, I will replace the electrolytic power supply caps before I attempt any sort of power up. More than a few times, I've seen caps short or become leaky and these bad parts can cause major damage.

Just take things slow, take plenty of notes as you go, and you'll do fine. Once you get the bugs worked out, you'll have a set that will be more reliable than most of the garbage made today.

Good luck. I think I recognize the photo from a local ad. So were probably in the same area, as well as, some other collectors/restorers. If you need any help testing the picture tube, tubes, etc., I hope we can help you out

Go for it. It's a very satisfying feeling to take something vintage like this and actually get it working again. A warning though.....once you start on this hobby you'll be hooked, and the number of sets in your house will begin to expand before you know it. Welcome!

So, unfortunately I'm not able to buy this TV right now. My mom says I have to finish my other projects first, and we are short on space.... But eventually I'm definitely going to get one, so thanks for all the info - at least now I know a little bit more about these. If anyone's interested, it's on the Chicago craigslist for $40, so a pretty good deal I think. I hope it goes to a good home.

And as "hi_volt" mentioned, it's true that this is an addicitve hobby - here's the list of stuff I have gotten so far:
1941 Westinghouse radio/phono combo - electrically restored with rebuilt cartridge (by West-Tech)
1937 Emerson R189 - missing a power transformer, but I haven't found one yet (posted a whole other thread about this)
1928 Sparton Equasonne 109 Deluxe - by far my favorite, all original but I haven't gotten to it yet.
1927 RCA Loudspeaker 106 - got it with the Sparton, and haven't done anything to it yet.

Hopefully I'll fix the Sparton while I'm home on summer break this summer

Not a bad idea at all. I have spent all spring finishing projects that have been sitting around half-done and even 90%-done for as long as 14 years.

It's fun to buy new toys, but it's also satisfying to complete a project and know that you've done it the right way.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

I am happy to hear of younger folks like yourself getting in to this hobbie. I was a bit younger that you when I caught the bug. All my friends thought I was crazy and my mother was not willing to part with space either. Mike,,,

Ah, so you got the Sparton. Nice score! I saved the pics from the craigslist post.
I know he listed it as a 109, but it's actually a model 110. More info can be found here: spartonequasonne.webs.com/models.htm
I really hope the pair of type 50 tubes are good.

Good luck,
Bob