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 Post subject: Schumerich-Carillons 225W Amp...What's it worth?
PostPosted: Jun Sat 19, 2010 12:51 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
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Location: Chesapeake, VA USA
I'm a collector of old tube radio and jukeboxes. Today I picked up a van load of old radios, portable record players, and electronic equipment.

In this load I picked up today was a very nice Schulmerich Carrillons, Inc Tube Amplifier. I don't see a particular model number unless it's what's stencilled on the back 6-202. This has input jacks for Phono, Mic, and Keyboard. Bronze colored Dials on the front are Keyboard, Mic, Phono, Tone (marked Deep Base, Mellow, Crisp, Brilliant). Marked at the bottom front 117V, 60CPS, 225W. I unscrewed the top vented cover to inspect the tube line up which uses dual GE 807 tubes with nice porcelin grid cap connectors. Also has 5U4 and 5Y3 Rectifiers, a pair of 6SF5 tubes, a 6SL7, and a 6SN7 (also used in my jukeboxes). This looks like a quality built unit. Looks like someone dribbled a little white paint on the top vented cover, but other than that, it's clean. There's not a lot of info on the web regarding Schulmerich Electronics, but it looks like they did a lot of Theatre audio work. Anyway, can someone tell me more about what this amp was used for and it's value?

Thanks,

Britt/Chesapeake, VA
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Sat 19, 2010 2:25 pm 
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It was used in a bell tower at a church or in a local park, where they would have had it set up to chime on the hour, quarter hour, etc. There were several other pieces of equipment associated with the amplifier. Sometimes an automated tune would be played on the hour, and it could also be used manually to play the keyboard as desired for special events.

Actual output is probably about 50 watts or so, but could be as high as 80 watts in the right circuit. The 225 watts is how much power it uses from the AC line and has nothing to do with audio output power.

A woman a few blocks from here had the entire carillon unit mounted in a large rack type cabinet for sale a couple of years back. She got it from her church when they went to a new digital system. IIRC she was asking between $100 and $200 for the whole thing but no one was interested. I heard that she did finally sell it at a much lower price several months later.

You can usually find PA amps similar to that at the big radio shows for prices starting at $25 on up. I don't see anything special about this one. Who knows what it could bring on eBay to the right buyer? Very heavy to ship.

The caps on the top of the 807's are the plates, and will have very high voltage on them, maybe 500 volts or more depending on the exact design of the amplifier. That's why the porcelain caps, to provide some insulation against accidental contact with the plate voltage.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Sun 20, 2010 4:51 pm 
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The knobs say "Bogen", so that's probably who made it for Schulmerich. Yeah, probably around 50-60 watts output.
Kevin

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Sun 20, 2010 4:53 pm 
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Location: Ellington CT
I'm sure the knobs don't actually "say" Bogen, but those are the type of knobs Bogen used for a while. The chassis layout also reminds me of Bogen PA amps. Used to work for a Muzak franchise as a bench tech, so I've seen many Bogens. Too freakin' many lol.
Kevin

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Mon 21, 2010 1:20 am 
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I use to install and service Schulmerich Carrillons. You have the amplifier section. It could have been used in the church PA system but most often it was used to power the speakers in the bell tower. They either used a cart of tape recordings of different bell tones you could select and program to play at specific times or the more expensive systems had a series of tuned metal bars with pick-ups that were struck to play bell tones through the tower speakers. Many of the amps were Bogen but sometimes the installer would use existing amps or another brand depending on the installation.

Installing church sound systems and bell systems is quite the racket. I left the company I was working for because I did not want to burn in hell for stealing from churches.

My boss would send me in to check out a bad sound system and how much time it would take to adjust or modify it to work correctly. Many times I would report back that it could be improved by some adjustments or by adding some EQ and repositioning some of the speakers, changing mics, etc.

Next thing I knew he was having us pull out a good $20,000 sound system and having the crew install junk at twice the price it should cost.

He'd then take the pulled system and sell it to the next church as new or demo equipment at a slight discount.

He was a rotten bast***.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Mon 21, 2010 2:48 am 
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Location: Chesapeake, VA USA
Guys, thanks for the info on the amp. Guess I'll pull the tubes and part it out.
Britt


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Mon 21, 2010 7:17 pm 
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Location: Litchfield Minnesota USA
wbaradio wrote:
Guys, thanks for the info on the amp. Guess I'll pull the tubes and part it out.
Britt


And then there is one less vintage amp around that probably has very good performance.
Why not try to invent a use for it, or sell it on ebay or wherever?
Maybe plug it in and listen to it work? You might be pleasantly surprised. I hate to see good quality stuff ripped apart. But then, that's just me, and who whe heck cares?
Mark D.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Mon 21, 2010 7:23 pm 
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Just about any complete tube amp is worth something at this point.
Myself, I would not part it out.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2010 1:33 am 
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You might be surprised what that amp would bring; the audio guys go nuts for stuff like that. Put it on Ebay.....

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2010 1:39 am 
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I agree, someone in another country far far away might pay good $$$ to purchase that unit and not care how much shipping cost. Locally, probably not such an easy sale.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2010 3:34 am 
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Quote:
You might be surprised what that amp would bring;


Darned right.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jul Wed 14, 2010 8:38 pm 
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Location: Indiana
That unit is most certainly made by Bogen, in fact it is identical to their own 807 powered PA amplifier. The knobs probably say db on them as well. I've got a CH-18 myself, converted to a guitar amp, and yes these do bring a little money online.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jul Sun 18, 2010 2:46 pm 
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Location: Chesapeake, VA USA
Guys, you can relax,.... I didn't part it out! I sold it to one of the Amp posters on this forum. For me, parting out is a last resort. So... another piece of amp history saved for posterity!
Britt
Chesapeake, VA


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jul Tue 27, 2010 1:50 am 
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Location: Harviell MO USA 63945 (12 miles S of Poplar Bluff)
Being on the receiving end of the old church equipment that's being replaced can be interesting, fun and scary! Our church was replacing its original electronic organ, a Baldwin model tube type, full AGO specs, two-manual, 32-note pedal (16' stops), chimes, full capture action including toe studs and was originally installed in the church when it was built around 1955. It was the only electronic organ in the St. Louis area when originally installed. Amazingly, it used nothing more than a pair of 10" speakers with no enclosures, mounted high in the pipe gallery (the church was designed to accommodate a pipe organ as an option) as the only output!

They were replacing it in 1982 or so with a 3-manual Allen digital computer organ and just pitching the old one. Mom asked me if I wanted it and I said "Yeah, I do!" That's like asking if you want a couple of elephants and then wondering what you're going to do with them one you have them. Somewhere along the line, it fell through the cracks and I guess the Allen deal just junked it. What a shame. It would have been great fun to restore, though I'd have caught merry heck from the wife since I'd want to put it in the living room or something like that.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jul Wed 28, 2010 9:16 pm 
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Location: miami fl
the amp just got to my hands. heavy beast. somebody had been on there and done some field repairs. not the worst ive seen but by far not the greatest.

i plan on recapping it and putting it to use in a mono setup. always wanted an amp with 807's and finally got one that isnt the size of a small fridge.

this is a shot in the dark but anyone got a schematic? i'm a bit concerned some of the repairs that were done may be a bit on the questionable side.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jul Wed 28, 2010 9:20 pm 
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Location: miami fl
the knobs do have the db emblem on them. did some research and it looks like it was a rebranded bogen ch60.

found a schematic so now im good to go. my goal is to undo the field repairs it has had done to it.


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 Post subject: Re: Schumerich-Carillons 225W Amp...What's it worth?
PostPosted: Nov Tue 29, 2011 9:34 pm 
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Joined: Feb Tue 23, 2010 4:19 am
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Location: boston
I really need some help with a Carillon tube amp of my own. I need to replace some filter caps (electrolytics), but they are not marked in any way and I don't have a schematic.
The tube complement is 2 x 5R4 GY, 2 x 807 (with porcelain caps), 2 x VR150, 3 x 6SN7, and 1 x 12AU7
The plate on the unit says Schulmerich 6-142 as a model number, but I'm coming up empty.
all the coupling caps under the chassis are marked and easily replaced, but the stand up multi-cap 'cans' have no markings whatsoever.
Any help appreciated, even as to what value caps I could guess at 40mfd 450V?


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 Post subject: Re: Schumerich-Carillons 225W Amp...What's it worth?
PostPosted: Nov Tue 29, 2011 9:44 pm 
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I have a few Shulmerich Amps and they are really decent and solidly built. Have none in in the 225 watt category, all mine run 6L6PP as finals. I suppose 807's PPP could push 100 watts on a good day, but really what do you have?


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 Post subject: Re: Schumerich-Carillons 225W Amp...What's it worth?
PostPosted: Nov Wed 30, 2011 1:16 am 
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Location: Detroit, MI USA
With 807's in the output, I would expect the electrolytics to be rated considerably higher than 450 volts. If you can't find a schematic you will need to take voltage measurements to verify what the B+ peaks at during initial power on before the remaining tubes warm up.

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Experience is what you gain when the results aren't what you were expecting.


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 Post subject: Re: Schumerich-Carillons 225W Amp...What's it worth?
PostPosted: Nov Wed 30, 2011 2:24 am 
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Gosh, pictures would have been nice...

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