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 Post subject: 1st restoration need HELP PLEASE
PostPosted: May Mon 02, 2011 11:20 pm 
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Joined: Apr Sun 17, 2011 8:18 pm
Posts: 1298
Location: Pennsylvania, 18706
Hey everyone,
About 3 weeks ago or so I started my 1st ever radio restoration, an RCA/Victor Model 17K. When I 1st got the radio it did absolutely nothing accept the dial lights lit up. I have now changed all the caps (the paper ones) including the 2 that were in the can on top of the chassis. I am sure I soldered the electrolytic ones with the correct polarity and that I used all the right values for every cap I changed. Now when I connect the speaker and plug in the chassis I get some faint static and when I adjust any of the knobs I get a varying degree of squealing. I dont have an antenna hooked up yet but I wouldnt think that that would make this much of a problem. Where do I go next? I was thinking to change the tubes? One tube when I turn it upside down has a little bit of white stuff laying in the glass but the tube does still light up. Im not good at reading schematics and I have a multi meter but dont really know how to use it. My electronic experience before this consisted of automotive mechanics and car stereo installation. Im excited to learn this stuff so any help will be GREATLY appreciated!
Thanks
Joe


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Tue 03, 2011 12:49 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
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Location: Cleona, PA
This radio came with a loop antenna that must be connected for it to operate on bands A and B. Are you sure you have the bandswitch in the manual broadcast position? Turn it all the way CCW and then one click back CW.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Tue 03, 2011 1:15 am 
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Check the resistors and replace all that are out of tolerance.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Tue 03, 2011 1:44 am 
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Location: Whitehall, Montana 59759
Don't know if your radio has tube shields, but make sure that they are in place if it does and you took them out for general cleaning of the chassis. I just did this on a Zenith 5s29 that I restored, and I was besides myself for about 15 minutes after firing it up after replacing caps/resistors and getting nothing but squealing. I then noted the shields standing idly by against the wall. Put them in place and I was up and running.


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 Post subject: Re: 1st restoration need HELP PLEASE
PostPosted: May Tue 03, 2011 2:24 am 
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Location: Sarasota, Florida
Joe Klein Jr. wrote:
Hey everyone,
About 3 weeks ago or so I started my 1st ever radio restoration, an RCA/Victor Model 17K. When I 1st got the radio it did absolutely nothing accept the dial lights lit up. I have now changed all the caps (the paper ones) including the 2 that were in the can on top of the chassis. I am sure I soldered the electrolytic ones with the correct polarity and that I used all the right values for every cap I changed. Now when I connect the speaker and plug in the chassis I get some faint static and when I adjust any of the knobs I get a varying degree of squealing. I dont have an antenna hooked up yet but I wouldnt think that that would make this much of a problem. Where do I go next? I was thinking to change the tubes? One tube when I turn it upside down has a little bit of white stuff laying in the glass but the tube does still light up. Im not good at reading schematics and I have a multi meter but dont really know how to use it. My electronic experience before this consisted of automotive mechanics and car stereo installation. Im excited to learn this stuff so any help will be GREATLY appreciated!
Thanks
Joe


You've got a radio, you know how to solder, and you have a multimeter. That's a GREAT start! Do you have a schematic to the set?

Here's what we have so far: you hear static. That means the audio amp is working. I'm assuming you can adjust the loudness of the static when you turn the volume control?

You've already replaced all the capacitors, and now you hear the static. You're pretty bold, but it appears you've done good so far. For the record, most of us, myself included, hook up the radio to test equipment and try to troubleshoot first, trying to get the radio playing, at least picking up a station audibly. Then replace caps, two or three at a time, and checking by applying power again. This way if the radio quits for some reason, you know it has to be related to the two or three components you just tinkered with. Someone else suggested replacing resistors; it can't hurt to check them, but I wouldn't go replacing them all at once just for grins. Better to start troubleshooting at this point.

Again, you hear static. This cuts the radio in half; conecntrate on the part that's in front of the volume control. You mentioned squealing -- possibly a hetrodyne whistle? A hetrodyne will change pitch as you tune up and down. A bad AVC capacitor will make a radio squeal loudly in this fashion, but as you said, you replaced the caps. Something else, and I just ran into this with a 1937 Cadillac radio, if the oscillator isn't running, you'll get static but will never pick up a station.

At this point your next step should be to connect an antenna. If the radio has a loop built in, connect it. See what happens. Beyond this, since you're on a very basic learning curve it would be wise to pick up a book or two on basic radio theory, to have a better understanding of how your radio works. Also, learn how to use the multimeter and read a schematic. All of this may seem overwhelming at the start, but it all works on some very simple principles, and learning the basics is easier than you think it might be. What I don't know is where you live -- if you can find your way to Sarasota, Florida, maybe you can stop by and I'll show you a few things to get you started.

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Gary Tayman, Sarasota, Florida


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Tue 03, 2011 1:44 pm 
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Joined: Apr Sun 17, 2011 8:18 pm
Posts: 1298
Location: Pennsylvania, 18706
TALK ABOUT EXCITED!! I DID IT! THE THING ACTUALLY WORKS NOW! Might not seem like a big deal to you guys but to me it's amazing. I NEVER did anything electronic like this before. I really have to thank everyone on here for all the help. I wouldnt have been able to get this working without everyones help. I still have a long way to go yet but i can actually pull in stations and listen to them. The problems I have now are that i get a TON of static when i turn a couple of the knobs and i have no tuning string yet. I can handle the tuning string but can somebody tell me how i can reduce the static or is that normal on these old radios?(or atleast on this model) Also it only seems to work with the knob in one position. Is this also normal? Im thinking thats the broadcast band then what would the other positions be for? Thanks again everyone of you that helped me out. it really is cool when something you do yourself and learn along the way works out!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Tue 03, 2011 1:51 pm 
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Joined: Apr Sun 17, 2011 8:18 pm
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Location: Pennsylvania, 18706
oh yeah but the way, i got a little excited and didnt tell everyone what was wrong. I connected the antenna and turned the bandswitch as described by wrnewton then I checked the resistors with the multimeter like tube radio said to do I dont know how to use this for this type of work like i said ive only ever done some car electronic stuff nothing major. Anyhow, the meter seemed to jump all over the place on one of the resistors so i replaced that one and now it works. I still get the heavy static though but once i tune in a station that goes away. I also still get a really loud squeal almost like feedback when i turn the tone selector. Thanks again everyone.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Tue 03, 2011 7:03 pm 
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Joined: Sep Tue 25, 2007 9:42 pm
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Location: Appleton, WI 54911 USA
For the static, I would try spritzing some contact cleaner into the volume control potentiometer and on the contacts on the tuning cap, then turn both a few times to clean them.

Isn't that a GREAT feeling, though? Now - BE CAREFUL - you'll want to start doing this over and over again!

8)

Mike


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Tue 03, 2011 11:30 pm 
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Joined: Apr Sun 17, 2011 8:18 pm
Posts: 1298
Location: Pennsylvania, 18706
oh, it's too late. I have been bitten! I've already bought a GE Model 741 radio/phono thats really beautiful. radio works (sort of) but the phono doesnt and i also bought an Airline off of ebay last week. That one works fine and looks great. Im using the Airline in my "radio room" where i will be working on learning this GREAT hobby! I just keep wondering, how many radios and vintage fans does one guy really need?? LOL
Joe

PS: I will try cleaning the contacts tonight and see what happens.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Wed 04, 2011 12:15 am 
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Location: Warner Robins, GA
There are never too many radios and fans unless you are married and the wife says no more :lol:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Wed 04, 2011 12:25 am 
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Joined: Apr Sun 17, 2011 8:18 pm
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Location: Pennsylvania, 18706
not married but the girlfriend is here and so far shes been good about it but i only have 2 fans and 3 radios so we will have to wait and see but shes into old vintage and antique stuff also so i think i will be ok ;-)
Joe


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Wed 04, 2011 1:08 am 
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That is good.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Wed 04, 2011 1:09 am 
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Double post


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Wed 04, 2011 1:40 am 
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Joe Klein Jr. wrote:
oh, it's too late. I have been bitten!

I just keep wondering, how many radios and vintage fans does one guy really need??

It's not a matter of need, AFA the physical quantity, but rather as the charge one gets when he brings a unit back to life. I've repaired radios for over 50 years, on and off, and I still get a thrill when I have diagnosed a problem, corrected it and turned the set on, and one or more radio stations come streaming in.

BTW, the static you describe, if it occurs as you are tuning, is most likely either dirt between the plates, or one or more are bent, and making contact with the stator plates. Clean, and then inspect carefully as you rotate from meshed to fully open.

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*******\\\\\\\\\******He Who Dies With The Most Radios Wins******/////////*******


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Wed 04, 2011 2:37 am 
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Joined: Apr Sun 17, 2011 8:18 pm
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Location: Pennsylvania, 18706
yes, i looked under the (i can never get this word right) petnometer? i know im way off on spelling/pronouncing that piece but anyhow i noticed that one ring is bent and it moves up and strikes the metal ring above it, there by making the satatic, but i wasnt sure if i could un bend that or if it was supposed to be that way and something else was wrong and makin it staticy. i cleaned the volume control very well and it stopped squeakin so i might try a little more tonight before i hit the hey for the evening,


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Wed 04, 2011 2:39 am 
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The metal ring is doing what it is supposed to be doing. That is what makes contact with the wiper that moves across the resistance element.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Wed 04, 2011 2:48 am 
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Location: Pennsylvania, 18706
then why when it gets to a certain point it will come in contact with the other ring and thats when the static starts? I dont understand


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May Wed 04, 2011 11:07 am 
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Joe Klein Jr. wrote:
then why when it gets to a certain point it will come in contact with the other ring and thats when the static starts? I dont understand

If you could take a picture of that certain point and post it, I am reasonably sure we could help you with it.

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*******\\\\\\\\\******He Who Dies With The Most Radios Wins******/////////*******


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