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 Post subject: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 03, 2019 2:44 am 
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Location: Metamora MI, 48455
I recently purchased a Stereo Realist camera to try my hand at stereographic photography. I usually shoot medium format, but with the reintroduction of Ektachrome on 35mm (and the ongoing pension fund problems at Kodak) I figured it would be worthwhile to pick up some sort of 35mm camera to shoot some color slide film before it finally goes the way of the dodo... again.

If I enjoy it, eventually get the hang of it, and somehow manage to shoot the occasional worthwhile photograph, I may well join the Detroit Stereographic Society. That remains to be seen though.

Anyway, does anyone here routinely shoot three dimensional photographs, either digitally, or preferably on film?


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 03, 2019 3:28 am 
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I don't take photos, but I found a case with a couple hundred Stereo slides from the mid 50's a while back.
I found a viewer for them shortly after and they are amazing to look at, Kodachrome and 3D really brings the past alive.


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 03, 2019 5:01 am 
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Location: Aurora, IL
I have a Realist and also a German Wirgin stereo camera although the Wirgin shutter no longer works. Don't routinely take photos with it though and haven't for many years. But went through a brief stereo photography period and have some nice shots that I mounted myself in viewing cards. Just recently got the Realist out and was thinking of getting some slide film and see if it still works. Maybe you gave me the nudge I needed. Stereo slides are very fun to view and it's good to hear I can get some Ektachrome.


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 03, 2019 5:20 am 
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Location: Sanford Fla 32771
I did some stereo photography based on the old stereo viewers from early 1900's. Used two digital cameras with homemade mount to provide correct spacing and alignment. With a reasonably good color printer results are quick allowing for various experiments to create good depth of field. Lots of info on line for doing this type stereo photo work.
My home made viewer.


Attachments:
SteroPhoto.JPG
SteroPhoto.JPG [ 180.09 KiB | Viewed 518 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 03, 2019 5:35 am 
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Location: S. Dartmouth MA 02748-1225 USA
I have been doing stereo photography for 40 years, Realist, Nimslo, Sony Mavica with a 3D slide bar, next project is landscapes with twin 35mm SLR's.

I have patents on stereo imaging of moving objects and the strobe flash for same.

What do you need to know? FWIR I may have posted a couple of digital stereos here. Would have to check my ARF attachment history...

Most of my digital views are family, personal so I cannot post. I may have some landscapes.

I do have hundreds of 3D of contest class winners at AWA Canandiagua during the 80's. These are mounted in glass for projection. I have scanned a couple of them, it is tedious and the scanner I used is very old, 1992 Artiscan with a lighted cover.

Chas

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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 03, 2019 6:08 am 
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Location: Black Hills, SD 57745
I have a Realist also, used it at a few dinosaur excavations and a scenic trip into Yellowstone. Haven't used it much in 10-12 years. It still has a partially exposed roll in it from my last pro shoot. Got it out awhile ago to remind me to finally finish that roll, then find out if the old film is still holding any images.

It was a useful tool to show size and perspective at a fossil dig site and during cleaning and mounting of dinosaur skeletons.

As Chas said, dual-cameras work great. With a U-shaped flat steel bar, I mounted two bodies with matching lenses finder-to-finder and had a stereo viewfinder so I could make sure the cameras were in register. That meant all the pics were verticals, same as the half-frame vertical of the Realist.

Another method to shoot either portrait or landscape stereo is a tripod adapter that shifts a single camera to left and right in a calculated arc to maintain image center in two separate frames. Anything that moved or changed in the time between the two pics will show up as motion blur or in different positions for each eye.

For scenics, getting eye-catching elements close/near/far is a must. Funny thing, the cluttered grab shots were as interesting as the tightly-framed and composed ones. Busy pics have a variety of things to look at and try to identify.

I lucked into a battery/bulb viewer. Having a bright, evenly-lit image with adjustable focus and inter-pupillary distance really helps.

If you can get the slides into your computer, it's relatively easy to make anaglpyhs of them for viewing with red/blue glasses.
-Ed

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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 03, 2019 8:59 pm 
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I have 2 Realist cameras, A Stereo Vivid, 2 Kodak Stereos, a Revere 33 and a couple of others. I also have a TDC 116 projector and viewers for each of the cameras. I put them all up when Kodachrome went off the market. Ektachrome and the other color reversal films have a poor grain structure in comparison to Kodachrome and Ektachrome ages very badly. All the EK slides my mother took as I was growing up have red shifted to just clear transparencies with no image. I treasure the Kodachrome transparencies I and my mother took. They look like they were made yesterday.

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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 03, 2019 10:19 pm 
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Location: Metamora MI, 48455
19&41 wrote:
I have 2 Realist cameras, A Stereo Vivid, 2 Kodak Stereos, a Revere 33 and a couple of others. I also have a TDC 116 projector and viewers for each of the cameras. I put them all up when Kodachrome went off the market. Ektachrome and the other color reversal films have a poor grain structure in comparison to Kodachrome and Ektachrome ages very badly. All the EK slides my mother took as I was growing up have red shifted to just clear transparencies with no image. I treasure the Kodachrome transparencies I and my mother took. They look like they were made yesterday.


The RMS granularity, which is strictly a measurement of noise and not film grain, was indeed much higher than Kodachrome for the previous generations of Ektachrome. That said, the new Ektachrome (the 2018 formula) actually has lower RMS granularity than the best Kodachrome variations. A lot of the lessons learned in the creation of the newer Ektar 100 were supposedly considered during the re-development of Ektachrome. The modern Ektachrome should look just as good, if not better, than Kodachrome with respect to grain and noise. With respect to color rendition, well, that's an open subject yet. I happen to prefer the look of Ektachrome to Kodachrome. I would hazard a guess that the vast, vast majority of people would feel differently. The modern formulations of Ektrachrome supposedly sport 80 year archival stability, but then I suppose we'll need to wait around for 80 years to see just how true that is.

Shoot a roll for the heck of it, you may be pleasantly surprised by the result. The cost is a bit exorbitant for what it is, but then that's the nature of shooting film in the first place.


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 03, 2019 11:59 pm 
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Nice DIY viewer, Paul!

Interesting info on the reformulated Ektachrome, Ben. I will have to look into it! Back in my pro days, I shot Ektachrome over Kodachrome mostly for same- or next-day processing, but also the faster 100 ISO. I needed every bit of speed for flash photography of room-filling dinosaur skeletons. Especially with their deep brown- to black-hued bones! It didn't help that we used mostly black backgrounds to hide any dust or film imperfections in print or projected presentations. I made reversal prints of the best poses for marketing and display. It was good money till the museum went digital and the owner's son took over photographic duties. I was ready to move on anyway and helped train my successor.

The stereo fossil pics were done on my expense and time. I retained ownership of all of those. Mounting is a bit tedious so I only mounted the best ones. Here's a couple anaglyphs, one of the T.rex digs and a view of Devil's Tower in Wyoming (The X across the image is from the demo anaglyph program I used to create it).
Attachment:
T-RexDigStereo.jpg
T-RexDigStereo.jpg [ 271.21 KiB | Viewed 423 times ]
Attachment:
DevilsTowerStereo.jpg
DevilsTowerStereo.jpg [ 497.19 KiB | Viewed 419 times ]

And here's a layout to print on cardstock and make your own stereo mounts. Cut out the squares with an exacto, trim each frame to size, affix the images, fold and tape closed.
Attachment:
stereo mount.pdf [21.85 KiB]
Downloaded 6 times


Tip: When you go to matching up stereo pairs from the slide film, the left/right image frames leap frog each other. If you swap left and right, you'll know it when you view it! :) If you take multiple images of the same scene, try to change the angle or view for each, so you can tell them apart later when mounting! Since they're half-frame, you won't always have a frame number to go by once you clip them apart.

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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Tue 04, 2019 1:20 am 
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I take 3-D photographs. It's rather simple. I take two photographs of the same view about a foot apart, then print them next to each other at a size that is smaller than pupil distance. My eyes are trained to uncross by looking far in distance but focused on the pictures. This merges the two pictures to give the 3-D effect.

I use a similar technique when I do scanning electron microscopy. It helps when you need to determine if a feature is standing proud or in relief.


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Tue 04, 2019 11:57 pm 
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I have the Fujifilm 3DW3 camera and it takes very good 3D digital photos, as well as regular 2D photos. It can even do 3D videos. I haven't taken the time to learn all its features and settings, so I just point and shoot. I can view them on the computer with 3D glasses, print them to view with 3D glasses or make my own Holmes Sterocards for viewing in an antique viewer. The last I remember is that 3D didn't take off and I think the digital camera makers gave up on the idea. I suppose the camera market is dying since most people use their phones to take pictures.

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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Sat 08, 2019 12:46 am 
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For those of you interested in this topic, look for a book co-authored by Brian May (yes, he of Queen fame!).

It is called A Village Lost And Found and is about a set of slides produced about 150 years ago showing scenes from an English village of that time. Which village it was was unknown until fairly recent times. Brian outlines the research which led to its discovery and the book contains many illustrations of the stereoscopic slides of the village.

The book also contains a fold out stereoscopic viewer so that the reader can view the images.

The book starts with a well-explained discussion of what stereoscopic viewing and how it works.

Entertaining and well worth the read.

Joseph


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Sat 08, 2019 1:38 am 
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In the early 1980's I recall attending a stereo multi image slide presentation put on by Rudy Bender in Seattle. The presentation used 2 stacks of 2 slide projectors with dissolve units projecting Kodachrome slides shot on 2 Oxberry pin registered Nikon cameras on a single tripod.

I remember my head really hurting when there was a slow lap dissolve between the 2 stacks of projectors...turns out that happend when 2 images shot with different focal length lenses were slowly mixed ..drove the brain crazy.

Frank


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Sat 08, 2019 2:15 am 
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A topic close to my heart...or maybe closer to my spleen. :roll: I would welcome thoughts about

1. Some years ago I bought a lens-front attachment designed for use with a 35mm camera. It takes the stereo pair with the single, fixed camera lens by use of a mirror arrangement. I was disappointed that it didn't work well with my DSLR. The two images had very little subject space overlap - regardless of what lens I used. Unfortunately, the mirrors are not adjustable.

2. I wonder what would result from shooting stereo pairs (by moving the camera between exposures) with a fisheye lens:
...2a. Full frame fisheye images
...2b. 180-degree circular images
...2c. 220-degree circular images (Nikkor 6mm f/5.6)

3. I have found that zooming during each (longish) exposure of a flat subject like a computer screen can give a strong, artificial stereo effect

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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Sat 08, 2019 5:25 am 
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SteiniteFan wrote:
A topic close to my heart...or maybe closer to my spleen. :roll: I would welcome thoughts about

1. Some years ago I bought a lens-front attachment designed for use with a 35mm camera. It takes the stereo pair with the single, fixed camera lens by use of a mirror arrangement. I was disappointed that it didn't work well with my DSLR. The two images had very little subject space overlap - regardless of what lens I used. Unfortunately, the mirrors are not adjustable.

2. I wonder what would result from shooting stereo pairs (by moving the camera between exposures) with a fisheye lens:
...2a. Full frame fisheye images
...2b. 180-degree circular images
...2c. 220-degree circular images (Nikkor 6mm f/5.6)

3. I have found that zooming during each (longish) exposure of a flat subject like a computer screen can give a strong, artificial stereo effect
1 - I had the opportunity to try the beam splitter stereo attachment. It works O.K. only on a 45-50 MM lens. Any other smaller prime lens there is distortion that is not uniform on either edges of the image pairs. The intent was to apply the splitter to machine imaging but we needed different lenses and thus it was usable. One of the mirrors fell out and it was discarded.

2 -The same distortion will occur on the edges of a fish-eye lenses.

3 - Interesting effect.

You may want to try making or buying a stereo slide bar. This is good for still life or subjects willing to co-operate and remain motionless for the 15 seconds or so while the camera is translated and re-aligned.

I lament that my camera is a bit heavy and the tripod a bit light so the camera has a tendency to tilt during a translation. I used to have a studio tripod that had 2" round telescoping legs and worm gear motion. I don't now why I saw fit to let it go...

If you have a pair of digital cameras, I would suggest alike as software and lenses across brands will be difficult to match. Such a pair, depending on the manufacturer may have either a wired TTL release or a WiFi/Blu-tooth release so they can be triggered simultaneously. Arranging on a bar to the Realist rule for spacing/distance, action in stereo can be recorded. An alternate trick is a single DSLR set for video and panning, however a moving subject in a pan will look odd as what occurs in one frame will not be in the other.

Ideally, it is the 3D art of the image with depth that is the goal with the least distortion and strain on the viewer.

I do have plans, probably later this year, to do some landscape with a pair of large prime lenses in 35mm.

Let us know how the fish-eye works out.

Chas

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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Sat 08, 2019 6:36 am 
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benman94 wrote:
With respect to color rendition, well, that's an open subject yet. I happen to prefer the look of Ektachrome to Kodachrome. I would hazard a guess that the vast, vast majority of people would feel differently. The modern formulations of Ektrachrome supposedly sport 80 year archival stability, but then I suppose we'll need to wait around for 80 years to see just how true that is.


I always like Kodachrome, much better than the old Ektachrome, and what killed them (Velvia) is horrific in terms of color rendition, it's like a gaudy cartoon. The only thing I didnt care for about Kodachrome was the tendency of the highlights to shift a little green.

Brett


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 17, 2019 4:36 pm 
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Brett_Buck wrote:
benman94 wrote:
With respect to color rendition, well, that's an open subject yet. I happen to prefer the look of Ektachrome to Kodachrome. I would hazard a guess that the vast, vast majority of people would feel differently. The modern formulations of Ektrachrome supposedly sport 80 year archival stability, but then I suppose we'll need to wait around for 80 years to see just how true that is.


I always like Kodachrome, much better than the old Ektachrome, and what killed them (Velvia) is horrific in terms of color rendition, it's like a gaudy cartoon. The only thing I didnt care for about Kodachrome was the tendency of the highlights to shift a little green.

Brett


Kodachrome, especially the final iterations, did have a nasty tendency to go green in a blown out highlight; it's part of the reason I switched to Ektachrome long before Kodachrome was axed.

And I completely agree on the Velvia. The Velvia 50 doesn't look as terrible as the Velvia 100, but that's an extremely low bar to begin with. I won't shoot Fuji stock, period. I haven't found anything they make that I actually like the look of.


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 17, 2019 4:42 pm 
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A little update on this; shortly after getting the Stereo Realist, I found a Kodak Stereo camera at a yard sale of all places, along with a Signet 35. I picked the pair up for $10. Having shot film with both the David White and the Kodak, I think I prefer the Kodak. The bubble level on the Kodak, along with the double exposure prevention, make it more or less idiot proof. In addition, the Kodak glass looks to be more substantial than that of the Realist. Also, the Realist has a well documented tendency to vignette at very small apertures whereas the Kodak is free of this defect.

About the only weak point on the Kodak is the shutter running slow, but that's normal for a mid-50s Kodak. I think I have mine moving again at the correct speeds, or very close, but if not I'll just send it out for a CLA. I need to look at my test rolls when they come back to make a decision one way or another.


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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 17, 2019 6:42 pm 
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Various aerial photo companies have been taking stereo pair images for quite a few decades.

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 Post subject: Re: Stereographic Photography - Any interest here?
PostPosted: Jun Mon 17, 2019 6:52 pm 
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benman94 wrote:
The Velvia 50 doesn't look as terrible as the Velvia 100, but that's an extremely low bar to begin with. I won't shoot Fuji stock, period. I haven't found anything they make that I actually like the look of.


100 didn't do as much evil to skin tones as the original or replacement 50, but otherwise seemed about the same to me. 100F was another story completely, looked very much like the later "supersaturated" Ektachrome. One would think that big photo companies like Kodak and Fuji, with their incredible history and corporate knowledge, could do better than a couple of amateurs in the 30s, but apparently not.

Kodak has always gone nuts over grain reduction, which is a shame, because that's about the least important thing about film, particularly color film. And yet, they can't stop selling Tri-X even though they have far lower-grained Tmax 400, because nobody wants Tmax 400.

Brett


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