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 Post subject: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Mon 21, 2021 11:42 pm 
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Started the process of taking apart the Scott and started with the power supply because I noticed there was an additional plug running through a vent hole in the box. Seeing that there was a 2-prong male end for a removable AC cord, it didn't make sense so I opened the unit up and discovered that someone took a cord and soldered one end to a prong that connects to the fuse as well, and the other is attached to the transformer (?) wire with electrical tape :shock: :shock: :shock:. My questions are thus:

1. Why would someone take the time to do this rather than just buy another AC cord? I'm not understanding such a "repair".
2. Is there a legit reason to leave this alone but add a new cord since the old one is dry rotted?
3. If not should I just resolder the connections and just scratch my head in wonder as to why someone did this?

EDIT: That power supply unit weighs 20 pounds. It's a beast!

Brian

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Last edited by Brubs on Jun Tue 22, 2021 3:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 12:01 am 
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Location: Redding, CA
Brubs wrote:
My questions are thus:

1. Why would someone take the time to do this rather than just buy another AC cord? I'm not understanding such a "repair".
2. Is there a legit reason to leave this alone but add a new cord since the old one is dry rotted?
3. If not should I just resolder the connections and just scratch my head in wonder as to why someone did this?

Brian


1: To save a few cents and possibly avoid a trip to the hardware/electronic supply store.
2: No
3: If by "resolder the connections" you are referring to restoring the original wiring, yes

Norman

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 12:38 am 
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Braithwaite wrote:
Brubs wrote:
My questions are thus:

1. Why would someone take the time to do this rather than just buy another AC cord? I'm not understanding such a "repair".
2. Is there a legit reason to leave this alone but add a new cord since the old one is dry rotted?
3. If not should I just resolder the connections and just scratch my head in wonder as to why someone did this?

Brian


1: To save a few cents and possibly avoid a trip to the hardware/electronic supply store.
2: No
3: If by "resolder the connections" you are referring to restoring the original wiring, yes

Norman


Norman I appreciate the response. Restoring and reattaching the wiring is what I meant by resoldering (reattaching) the wiring as originally intended.

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 1:10 am 
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Noticing that it looks like a cap is leaking as well. I guess either cutting the can and restuffing it, or disconnecting it and wiring a new cap underneath if there is room to do so is in my future...


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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 2:21 am 
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Lost the cheater cord?


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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 3:00 am 
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Wow. Yes, put it back the way it was originally. Un-polarized (same sized pins) cords are hard to find now so I would replace the connector with a polarized one (one large pin, one small pin).
Using tape to insulate wires carrying power is not a good idea despite the existence of "electrical tape".
Tape like that becomes dried out over time and often falls off.
I will also point out that the replacement cord was routed through a small hole on the metal chassis without at least a grommet. The edge of the hole will cut through the insulation in time.
I always like to fix things so that they will last (safely also) at least as long as they have already been around.

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 3:14 am 
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i suspect that the person that did that had no idea where to get the correct type of cord.

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 3:59 pm 
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Brubs, I was expecting any moment for you to ask where to get a new connector. I have gotten them before but I don't remember where. I think I got them at Radio Daze but I just checked there and they don't have them.

That brings up a point, situations change, what was available two years ago might be very difficult to find now. For instance a one man source of parts, Playthings of the Past, closed recently, the fellow passed away. ESRC, handling vacuum tubes is gone for the same reason. Radio Daze is carrying fewer items.
Places like Mouser and Digikey that have tens of thousands of parts handle very few vintage type parts.
Non-polarized cords are harder to find than the polarized cords but if you can't find the replacement polarized connector then changing the type might not be the best choice. A non-polarized might be found sooner. Don't drill out the rivets that hold the old connector until you have the new connector. You might have to put a project to the side until you can find the right parts. Sometimes you have to find a junk chassis you can salvage something from, swapmeets are good for that.

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 6:12 pm 
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Notimetolooz wrote:
Brubs, I was expecting any moment for you to ask where to get a new connector. I have gotten them before but I don't remember where. I think I got them at Radio Daze but I just checked there and they don't have them.

That brings up a point, situations change, what was available two years ago might be very difficult to find now. For instance a one man source of parts, Playthings of the Past, closed recently, the fellow passed away. ESRC, handling vacuum tubes is gone for the same reason. Radio Daze is carrying fewer items.
Places like Mouser and Digikey that have tens of thousands of parts handle very few vintage type parts.
Non-polarized cords are harder to find than the polarized cords but if you can't find the replacement polarized connector then changing the type might not be the best choice. A non-polarized might be found sooner. Don't drill out the rivets that hold the old connector until you have the new connector. You might have to put a project to the side until you can find the right parts. Sometimes you have to find a junk chassis you can salvage something from, swapmeets are good for that.


Tim, you beat me to it because I was unable until now to ask about a resource for replacement polarized connector! Oddly enough, I have three non-polarized cheater cords that are NOS from Zenith. Would your suggestion be to simply leave well enough alone and use it as originally designed, or swap out for a polarized connector if I can locate one? EDIT: I just purchased two polarized AC receptacles on eBay just to have in case.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/112409235735?hash=item1a2c1cd117:g:NEIAAOSw9GhYcTbI
Brian

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 6:52 pm 
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If you have replacement original style non-polarized cheater cords I'd just use those. On a transformer set there's no hot chassis, so power cord polarization is completely unimportant to safety.
I always keep look out for good used or new replacement cheater cords, and keep a shopping bag worth for my projects.
It usually disgusts me when I see someone who has retrofitted a newer style cord connector (especially those PC 3 prong connectors, barf) onto a vintage set...It's sort of like when I go to a car show and see some 40's or 50's car that looks stock till you poke your head in the window and see the steering column is from some 70's junker, the dash has been hacked up for aftermarket guages and stereo, the seats are from a 90's civic, etc... basically someone took a piece of art and drew a Groucho Marx moustache and glasses on every person in it.

For those of you that can't find the non-polarized cords with the mounting ears, or the type with the groove for a back cover retaining clip there is a readily available temporary/permanent solution...ACE Hardware sells mixer cords that are the same pin fitment as the non-polarized cords most TVs used. The ACE cords lack the mounting ears and mounting grooves that original cords do but will plug into any TV that used the older cords...you can use them till you find an original cord with the correct mounting style, even if you never find one if you sell your set to someone like me they'll be glad you didn't hack in a non-original connector.
https://www.acehardware.com/departments ... ords/31460


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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 10:40 pm 
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Playthings of the Past has a new owner. Not sure when it will be back up and running: http://www.oldradioparts.com/

The owner of ESRC passed away and his business was in a mess apparently and won't be coming back.

Surplus Sales of Nebraska sometimes has this type of cord in stock. https://www.surplussales.com/Electrical ... rds-1.html

Then there's always eBay. You want to search for "non-polarized AC cheater cord".


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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jun Tue 22, 2021 11:02 pm 
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bandersen wrote:
Playthings of the Past has a new owner. Not sure when it will be back up and running: http://www.oldradioparts.com/

Yes, I knew about the new owner. A member of this forum in fact.
There is so much stuff and although prior owner knew where everything was there was little or no documentation. The new owner has been in the process of going through it all for some time now.
Just one of the many stories you get to hear about when you hang around here long enough.

Several years ago when I was working on a jukebox I discovered it had a shorted power transformer.
The transformer was a special part used only by the maker of the 1958 jukebox. I tracked down a source
of parts but then found out he had recently died. I talked to his son, who didn't know much about the business. His son went through his dad's stuff and found the transformer (he only found one) and we made a deal for it.
If I happened to be working on the jukebox a couple of months later I might never have found one.

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jul Sun 04, 2021 6:45 pm 
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I agree the non-polarized power cords (we called them cheater cords) are very hard to find. They are easy to remove from the back with a little heat which makes then stretchy and if you find a new one you can replace it without removing the rivets.

I do however have a small quantity of the two-pin, non-polarized connectors that look just like the one in your power supply chassis I would send one free if you need it. I needed one for an Admiral and had to buy a bag of 20.

My 6T11 has a rather long original power cord which is getting a little rotten at the wall plug end so I don't leave it plugged in. It is affixed to the back panel which is perforated metal. I always work on it from the top and don't believe I have ever had the back off.

I have used the reproduction can electrolytic's and would think you could find one near the value of the originals. I don't like re-stuffing them as the replacements seem to go bad sooner than the old cans. My 6T11 still has the original cans and seems to work OK.


Jim


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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jul Mon 05, 2021 4:32 am 
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I agree with you Jim about restuffing electros. I never do it.
The much smaller replacements have little chance of surviving long with the conditions due to their relatively low ripple current ratings.

I have found this part to be very useful in replacing many 1 and 2 part can electros. There are others in the range as well.

https://tubedepot.com/products/jj-can-c ... -50uf-500v

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jul Mon 05, 2021 2:39 pm 
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Looks to me that there is plenty of room under the chassis to install replacement capacitors. Just disconnect the old one and leave them in place for appearance.

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jul Tue 06, 2021 9:16 am 
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Be that as it may, the new ones will still be too small and will chop out quickly with the ripple current.

Do it properly!

These JJ can electros are the right stuff for little money. I've used lots of them.

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jul Tue 06, 2021 3:22 pm 
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I think you are overly concerned with ripple current.
Power supply today have to handle ripple current just like the vintage power supplies, and mounted on PCBs to boot.
Leaded capacitors are available with a variety of ripple current carrying abilities. You just have to select with that in mind if you are worried about it. I've never seen any ripple current specs on vintage capacitors to compare with modern versions.
https://www.digikey.com/en/products/fil ... eNJDE5H6gA

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 Post subject: Re: Scott 6T11A Power Supply AC Issue
PostPosted: Jul Tue 06, 2021 5:01 pm 
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I don't recall the manufactur of the twist-loc type electrolytic I used in my little Admiral 7" TV but I got rid of a clog of axial lead capacitors I had stuffed in ubder the chassis with zip ties. It is now a thing of bueaty.

The original Can Electro had a big glob of solder on two of the twists that I paid Hell removing so when I put the new one in I used a short chunk of bare wire to tie it to a solid chassis ground near by.

I got my can electro from Antique Electronic supply and the manufacture is using original tools and methodes to make new cans from brand new ingreadints, To me "good as new".

I had a four cubic foot box full of those cardboard tube electrolytics (Firecracker type) that were new old stock I salvaged from a defunct electronics dealer. I tried to use these and never found a single cap in the box that was good in hundreds. These are being manufactured new as well.

You may not find the exact value as the original but there are values that will work just fine.

Jim


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