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 Post subject: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Sun 21, 2021 6:33 am 
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Hi all,

Just picked up this 1964 RCA New Vista DF 455 W. It’s in great cosmetic condition and the CRT tests excellent (23ENP4). Just curious if anyone had any information on this set? Looking for the schematics as well to recap, etc. Sams has it but I just wanted to check here first to see if anyone had any pointers in the restoration, or just about the set in general.

Thanks everyone!

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Sun 21, 2021 6:40 am 
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That is new enough that they might have used Mylar caps instead of paper caps.

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Sun 21, 2021 1:22 pm 
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Location: British Columbia
I have one, and it may save you a lot of headaches. Whilst you have the chassis out make sure that you resolder all the joints between the printed circuit board and the tube sockets, that is a weak point in sets like these, tubes and printed circuit boards are a bad mix.


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Sun 21, 2021 3:31 pm 
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Location: Detroit, MI USA
As noted, RCA had major issues with solder failures on their PC boards, both where the tube sockets connected, and even worse at the supporting stakes where the PC board was soldered to the chassis and supposedly grounded. It was not unusual on an RCA a few years old to need to resolder every single ground support stake as well as all of the tube sockets.

At that time, there may have been some difilm type caps containing both paper and mylar. Sometimes they will check perfectly fine for leakage but develop some strange internal failure and won't work good in the circuit.

RCA's also had way more than their share of tuner issues, we were always having to send them out to the local tuner rebuilder.

These sets do work nicely when everything is right, and have a picture nearly as good as a Zenith.

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Sun 21, 2021 5:17 pm 
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Thank you all for the tips, much appreciated! Working on a few Predictas right now and am all too familiar with poor ground stakes. I’ll be sure and get the Sam’s, thanks again!


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Sun 21, 2021 6:14 pm 
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Mr. Detrola wrote:
At that time, there may have been some difilm type caps containing both paper and mylar. Sometimes they will check perfectly fine for leakage but develop some strange internal failure and won't work good in the circuit.


The worst offenders are older orange drops. Nearly every one made before around the mid 70's has failed. They don't get leaky, but the dissipation factor (measured with my Genrad 1658) increases 10x or more compared to a good cap. The measured capacitance also increases by 20-50%, and is also a good way to detect the bad ones. I think the issue is that the paper becomes slightly conductive, and effectively decreases the thickness of the dielectric. This increases capacitance, but also makes is lossey since the paper isn't a good conductor.

Interestingly, I've never seen this with other brands of caps from the same period. All the brown drops, maroon drops, and tubular mylar caps I've checked still measure and work perfectly.

I would replace the orange drops if it has any, and the small electrolytics. The cans may be fine, but most people like to replace them at this point.


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Sun 21, 2021 6:17 pm 
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Location: New Hampshire
Oh I forgot. DO NOT spray a nuvistor tuner. If it has to be cleaned pull the
shield (s) & just put a small amount on the switches. Spraying can cause the RF amp to go into
oscillation.
This set will be a walk in the park compaired to the Predictas.


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Mon 22, 2021 12:16 am 
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If it has any Elmenco white tubular ceramic body caps like the same year CTC16 color sets do you want to replace them since they are paper and are prone to shorting.

There's a chance it will wake right up and work if you variac it. I just had a stock CTC16 in abominable condition come right up and work on original parts (well I did have to swap a tube and color crystal in).


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Mon 22, 2021 11:23 pm 
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Thanks for the input, everyone. Very much appreciated. Just buttoned up the electrical restoration on this Siesta today and will shift my focus to the RCA. Powered the set up, but it looks like it doesn’t have any HV. No pic, no sound. Same for the radio. Time to order the Sam’s and dive in!

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Tue 23, 2021 3:02 pm 
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I have seen some of the early "Brown Drops" go leaky, as well as the green ones that RCA used. It's worth checking them on a good capacitor checker; some of them do not show a good null on the bridge. Those get replaced

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Tue 23, 2021 11:24 pm 
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Started by replacing all the orange drops, not too many of them but this one was definitely done! It looks brown but it’s actually orange. Looks like it overheated badly and split open. New one seems to work much better! Got a raster and sound now.

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Wed 24, 2021 12:27 am 
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Wow! I've never seen one look like that.

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Wed 24, 2021 12:59 am 
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I've seen some orange drops turn partially brown and crack open cleanly before but that thing looks like it had a more firey demise.


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Wed 24, 2021 2:32 am 
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I’ve never seen one this bad either! Happy those are all out of the set. I think the next issue to address is the tuner. Using an rf modulator that works extremely well on all of our other sets, I am able to get a picture but it’s still very fuzzy. Aside from this, the vhf knob on the tuner seems to be locked up solid, so I’m sure an inspection of the tuner is in order. Also am going to work on replacing the electrolytics (I know this should have come first but the set was not run for more than a minute). Also got the Sams and that’s been a big help. Thanks for all the input everyone, it’s greatly appreciated!


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Wed 24, 2021 2:48 am 
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bazil wrote:
I think the next issue to address is the tuner. Using an rf modulator that works extremely well on all of our other sets, I am able to get a picture but it’s still very fuzzy. Aside from this, the vhf knob on the tuner seems to be locked up solid, so I’m sure an inspection of the tuner is in order.

After you fix that mechanical problem, try slightly turning the channel selector, about 1/4 of the amount needed to go the the next channel, and see if the picture changes erratically. If it does use contact cleaner on the contacts. Then adjust the fine tuning and see it that sharpens the picture.

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Wed 24, 2021 2:50 am 
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Tom Schulz wrote:
bazil wrote:
I think the next issue to address is the tuner. Using an rf modulator that works extremely well on all of our other sets, I am able to get a picture but it’s still very fuzzy. Aside from this, the vhf knob on the tuner seems to be locked up solid, so I’m sure an inspection of the tuner is in order.

After you fix that mechanical problem, try slightly turning the channel selector, about 1/4 of the amount needed to go the the next channel, and see if the picture changes erratically. If it does use contact cleaner on the contacts. Then adjust the fine tuning and see it that sharpens the picture.


Will do, thanks for the input!


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Wed 24, 2021 1:52 pm 
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Tim Tress wrote:
I have seen some of the early "Brown Drops" go leaky, as well as the green ones that RCA used. It's worth checking them on a good capacitor checker; some of them do not show a good null on the bridge. Those get replaced

Back in the later 70s or early 80s, I bought a lot of Orange Drop capacitors that were being wholesaled out for very little money. I looked at them a few months ago and also found many that were cracked. I tested them and they tested OK. But the final test, which was inspired by Curt Reed was the metal bin test. Yes, they did make a loud sound when they were tossed out. So, I really didn't save anything by getting them at a discount way back when! What did save my butt was the help over the years by you guys that warned me about old capacitors.

You were right...

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Wed 24, 2021 1:52 pm 
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bazil wrote:
Started by replacing all the orange drops, not too many of them but this one was definitely done! It looks brown but it’s actually orange. Looks like it overheated badly and split open. New one seems to work much better! Got a raster and sound now.

Attachment:
DC9FF44E-B167-4912-8F5E-CD7362830C9C.jpeg

Attachment:
F246F985-B303-420B-B6BE-3F851E674F0E.jpeg


Now that is cool! Success, congratulatons.

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Wed 24, 2021 4:43 pm 
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The caps in that era of RCA really take a beating. Not only are the ones in the deflection circuits under heavy electrical stress, but they are also right next to hot tubes and power resistors.


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 RCA New Vista
PostPosted: Nov Wed 24, 2021 7:16 pm 
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bazil wrote:
Thanks for the input, everyone. Very much appreciated. Just buttoned up the electrical restoration on this Siesta today and will shift my focus to the RCA. Powered the set up, but it looks like it doesn’t have any HV. No pic, no sound. Same for the radio. Time to order the Sam’s and dive in!

Attachment:
The attachment 2E01AF5B-77ED-4A7F-A721-F3DBE9D4C633.jpeg is no longer available



Love the Siesta! out of the 17" Predictas that one is my favorite model. Looks like you did a great job on the electronic restoration too,it shows a nice picture. Now youre ready to make some popcorn and watch some tv......Just make sure not to put the metal Jiffy Pop pan in the microwave. :lol:


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