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 Post subject: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Feb Mon 22, 2021 7:26 pm 
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Joined: Feb Sat 20, 2021 3:53 am
Posts: 8
I found a lot of resistors out of tolerences. Can these be replaced with 1watt resistors? Also found a lot of bad wire that has cracked and crumbly insulation. What size wire can i use for replacement and does it matter if it is solid or stranded wire? Is there a minimum votage rating for the wire in these old tube radios. Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Feb Mon 22, 2021 7:56 pm 
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Joined: Jan Tue 31, 2012 1:55 am
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Location: Mountains of Mourne. Ireland.
stranded v solid, sources and other questions can be seen in these postings at arf

hookup wire site:antiqueradios.com
https://www.google.com/search?q=hookup+ ... 8&oe=utf-8

complete google search phrase in bold.


:) Greg.
yes, a good supplier or manufacturer will list the Voltage rating.

Take note / observe lead-dress (the exact position and pathways of all wires), it can often be important, and / or critical to the operation of a set.


Edit:
aleeeeaaa wrote: I found a lot of resistors out of tolerance. Can these be replaced with 1 Watt resistors?

It is best to include the make and model of the set that you are working on.
Many / most will have a parts list with ratings.


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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Feb Mon 22, 2021 8:09 pm 
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Location: Charleston, W.Va.
Hi aleeeaa,
Your replacement resistors should be the same or higher wattage rating as the originals.

Bad wire insulation can be dealt with by either replacing the entire wire, or by lifting one end and slipping a piece of heat-shrink tubing over the old wire. As egg has mentioned, keep lead dress as nearly as possible the same as original.

When deciding between solid or stranded wire, my practice is to replace it with whatever was originally used in the radio.

For the Philco radio in your photo, 20-gauge wire will be adequate.

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Poston


Last edited by Poston Drake on Feb Mon 22, 2021 8:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Feb Mon 22, 2021 8:13 pm 
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Joined: Jan Tue 31, 2012 1:55 am
Posts: 18669
Location: Mountains of Mourne. Ireland.
For sketchy / fragile (power) Transformer wires this can come in handy at times...

Performix Liquid Electrical Tape.
Image
Walmart: 1003203

Greg.


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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Feb Mon 22, 2021 8:21 pm 
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I myself would consider that in most tube radios, many resistors above maybe 10k and probably all above 100k, can be half watt resistors, as the high value resistors in receivers are mostly tube bias and do not handle a great deal of current. There are exceptions to that. But alot of resistors 5k and below will be larger when used as voltage dividers and part of an R/C filter network and thus might even benefit from being the next higher value or ceramic wirewound types. The only issue with higher power resistors than original is making them fit in the given space. And if they run hot, not have them resting on anything. You can use whatever you can fit that you have on hand as long as it is at least the same wattage as original, until you gain enough electronic knowledge to know what is what. Occasionally parts were over rated just because parts on hand were cheaper than buying more.

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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Feb Mon 22, 2021 11:49 pm 
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Location: Corinth, TX
Hookup wire is generally 20 or 22 gauge unless it is carrying current. Then it is 16 or 18 gauge wire. If it is carrying a LOT of current, they may use 12 gauge wire. Solid wire is more convenient to work with, but mil-spec requires stranded. Pre-tinnig, although that requires the extra step, makes the wire a bit easier to work with.

Stranded wire improves vibration resistance.

John


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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Feb Tue 23, 2021 12:02 am 
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Location: Annapolis, MD
Wire:
Build and maintain an inventory of:
#20 solid and stranded
#22 solid and stranded
maybe even 16 and 18 for high-current filament supplies
---stock enough colors to be able to rebuild typical cables---eg the multi-wire cables going to the speaker in a typical 30s set.

Save scraps of wire whenever the insulation is sound. You can NEVER have too many wire scraps......

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"Voltage is fun to watch, but it's the CURRENT that does the work."


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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Feb Tue 23, 2021 3:51 am 
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Thanks for the help.I think i'm on the right track.


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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Feb Wed 24, 2021 5:43 pm 
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Location: Cottage Grove, Minnesota
Some of the items you may think are resistors might be capacitors. I see one in your picture that is possibly a capacitor. It's on the right side of the pic nestled between two paper and wax capacitors, brown body with silver on one end and red on the other end. Check your schematic to make sure.

There is no harm in using 1 watt resistors to replace quarter and half watt ones, other than the expense. The size of modern resistors are so small compared to ones originally used in most tube radios that size shouldn't be a concern.

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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Sep Fri 10, 2021 8:19 pm 
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Joined: Dec Fri 04, 2015 6:31 pm
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Location: Asheville, NC
Behold the resurrection of a deceased thread!

I wonder if anyone has opinions on wire jacket materials, i.e. plastic, rubber, silicone rubber, silicone, TFE/PTFE, as well as voltage ratings. I restored an Atwater Kent 206 with B+ over 700 volts where someone before me had used 600v hookup wire. Is this a problem? It was working fine, but would silicone or silicone rubber 1000v wire be a more reliable long-term choice?

Thank you for your thoughts and opinions.

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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Sep Fri 10, 2021 9:45 pm 
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Location: Near Brandon, Iowa
mrcowden wrote:
Behold the resurrection of a deceased thread!

I wonder if anyone has opinions on wire jacket materials, i.e. plastic, rubber, silicone rubber, silicone, TFE/PTFE, as well as voltage ratings. I restored an Atwater Kent 206 with B+ over 700 volts where someone before me had used 600v hookup wire. Is this a problem? It was working fine, but would silicone or silicone rubber 1000v wire be a more reliable long-term choice?

Thank you for your thoughts and opinions.

An AK 206 has nowhere near 700V on the B+ bus. This might be the AC voltage across the two ends of the power transformer's HV winding; but the rectified voltage produced by the type 80 tube is only going to be around 325V, tops (25V is lost in the rectifier). After the speaker field winding it's going to be much less, probably on the order of 275 VDC. (Note that the first electrolytic filter cap hanging on the output of the 80 tube, which is the most positive DC voltage in the radio, is only rated for 475VDC).

If the set in question truly has 700VDC on the B+ bus, the voltage rating of the hookup wire would be the least of your worries! 600V wiring is just fine for this set.


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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Sep Fri 10, 2021 10:21 pm 
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Location: S. Dartmouth MA 02748-1225 USA
If brittle rubber covered wire is still intact but needs to be moved for access, heat the area and the wire with a heat gun, this will bring flexibility to the wire so long as it is heated enough to move, do the job, heat again to replace the old wire..

For outright replacement of wires. Disconnect from one end, solder old wire to new, pull through new wire, then the wire will be in the same route as the original, solder new wire to old starting location. Radios require wiring to be in certain areas. Re-routing can cause feed back and take considerable time to remedy. It is best, if possible to use the same wire color code as that is an aid in troubleshooting, if not now, later. A tracer on a new wire can be done by drawing the wire through the fingers pinching a felt tip marker pen.

If wholesale replacing components, start with power supply then operate the radio so to determine that the new parts are correct, then replace two parts at a time and test. very often components will be installed incorrectly or a short developed from wire clippings or solder blobs... Hard to reach terminal strips often get solder blobs or tails of wires hitting another terminal.

Often a "triage" is needed first to determine if hard to find/repair parts have been compromised, like RF transformers... That avoids hours lost on a repair that is impossible because of a special coil that cannot be fixed...

GL

Chas

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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Sep Sat 11, 2021 4:19 am 
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Joined: Dec Fri 04, 2015 6:31 pm
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Location: Asheville, NC
lorenz200w wrote:
An AK 206 has nowhere near 700V on the B+ bus. This might be the AC voltage across the two ends of the power transformer's HV winding;


You are right - I was looking at the value across the transformer. Whoopsie! Do you have any preferences for insulation materials for long-term durability? Thank you for the detailed reply.

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 Post subject: Re: Resitors and Wire
PostPosted: Sep Sat 11, 2021 4:30 am 
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Location: Annapolis, MD
Side note on resistors: I think I am not the only shade-tree radio fixer that is moving towards stocking only 1-watt (or maybe 2-watt film and/or Metal Oxide resistors.When I finally trashed my stash of 1/2-watt carbon comps, I think someone, somewhere, turned over in their grave.

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"Voltage is fun to watch, but it's the CURRENT that does the work."


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