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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Thu 02, 2003 11:31 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 88
Location: Brooklyn, NY USA
Hello all,<P>What is the adhesive of choice to repair a crack in a bakelite table model?<P>There is no gap, crack is tight and closed from back edge, across top. about 6" long.<P>Thanks<BR><P>------------------<BR>


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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Fri 03, 2003 12:20 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 337
Location: Boucherville, Quebec, Canada
I've used "crazy glue" quite a few times with very good results.<P>I found that once cured, you can gently scape the excess with a very sharp blade then polish the cabinet. The repair will be almost invisible.<P>I'm sure this is not the only solution, but it works for me.<P> Eric<P>------------------<BR>


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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Fri 03, 2003 4:49 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 11100
Location: Vieques, PR, USA
I've had no problems at all using 'crazy glue' for such repairs although you will have to open the crack a bit to get it inside.<BR>I think CA glues being so thin has a lot to do with making a nice neat repair of such a crack while still having some strength. Other types of breaks might do better with something else.<BR>-My 2c.<BR>-Bill<P>------------------<BR>


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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Fri 03, 2003 1:18 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 1146
Location: London,England
Hello<BR>I think it was Norm who said never open the crack for the glue, you just make it look bigger. If anything close it up first, before applying the glue. Strap parcel tape across the outside to do this. Then, using the thinest super glue, dribble this on the inside with the crack downwards. Gravity and capilary will pull it in where it can.<BR>I do this, and after a day or so, for it to harden, reinforce the crack on the inside. I do this by abrading the surface and even drilling (Dremel)lots of small holes, half way into the thickness of the Bakelite, each side of the crack. Then I have used epoxy with a couple of layers of very thin glass fibre cloth laid into it.<BR>Gary <P>------------------<BR>


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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Fri 03, 2003 4:59 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 4541
Location: Charleston, W.Va.
Hello Gary,<BR>I have done very few Bakelite crack repairs, so am always interested in suggestions on this subject. Your method of reinforcing the crack on the inside is apparently used by a number of other restorers. I wonder about the necessity of the fiberglass cloth. I would think the major concern is adhesion of the epoxy to the bakelite; you are attempting to deal with this by the abrasion and drilling of small "anchor holes" in the Bakelite. But if this is successful and the epoxy actually adheres well, the repair would seem to me to be equally strong either with or without the fiberglass cloth. If one applies a large drop of epoxy to waxed paper, allows it to cure, then removes the epoxy glob from the paper, it is nearly impossible to break or cut it in half. <P>------------------<BR>Poston


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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Sat 04, 2003 7:55 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 1146
Location: London,England
Hello Posten<BR>You may be right....still belt and braces does not hurt and it depends on the severity of the crack. Small ones I wouldn't bother, big ones I probably would.<BR>Gary<P>------------------<BR>


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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Sat 04, 2003 8:06 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 4541
Location: Charleston, W.Va.
Gary,<BR>In cases where a small piece of Bakelite is missing from the damaged area, what do you use for a filler?<P>------------------<BR>Poston


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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Sat 04, 2003 8:28 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 88
Location: Brooklyn, NY USA
Thanks for all the ideas.<P>I have a junker to experiment with before I work on the actual radio.<P>I'll experiment and let you know the outcome.<P>Again, thanks all.<P><P>------------------<BR>


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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Sat 04, 2003 2:18 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 1146
Location: London,England
Hello Posten<BR>I have tried several ways. Best was to first repair, from the inside, with glass fibre cloth and epoxy. Then build up the hole with more of the same but leave sub flush. Finally fill the top with epoxy with cocoa mixed into it. Can't put too much as it gets weak and doesn't set properly. However, not a lot is needed, normally. Later sand off with wet and dry and then polish with metal polish... takes a dull shine. Only good where small pieces are missing. For bigger I guess the best way would be to find a piece of Bakelite and cut that closely to fit in. Never had to do that. Have repaired missing chunks, from the bottom, with all fibre glass/epoxy and smooth paste filler. Then rubbed down the whole bottom and spray painted all of it.<BR>Works well.<BR>Gary<P>------------------<BR>


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 Post subject: Bakelite adhesive
PostPosted: Oct Sat 04, 2003 11:24 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 2161
Location: Sandusky, OH usa
My technique for filling holes depends on the size of the hole but for very small ones I usually just keep layering in super glue and immediately begin sanding the area with about 400 grit black oxide sandpaper and this causes all the dust generated from the bakelite being sanded to adhere to the super glue and also cause it to set up VERY fast! I call this process "bakebond" or "Permalite" since I use Permabond brand super glue which is dirt cheap at the local Big Lots store. <P>I also use clear packing tape placed over the fresh super glue to cover the work area sometimes instead of sanding it immediately as this seems to hasten the cure time of the glue and lets you build it up faster on light cracks and also leaves a smoother surface which allows for less finish sanding. If you flip the tape over and place it smooth side (non glued side) down it will leave a very shiny surface when dry and peel right off when the super glue sets up in about a minute or so depending on the brand of glue you use.<P>I make up strips of clear packing tape with one side folded into itself and then placed on another piece which allows me to not have to hold it while it dries, I just place the tape over the work area and stick it down with the non sticky piece in the center over the fresh super glue. It works great and you can scrape off the excess super glue with a single edged razor blade to speed up the buildup process as you go. Makes for easier final polishing also as super glue WILL polish out to a shine when hard!<P>You can also use a piece of old broken bakelite that matches the color of your set as a filler by grinding it down with your Dremel sanding attachment and taking the resulting bakelite dust and sprinkle it into the freshly laid super glue thus creating NEW bakelite! Keep in mind, bakelite is basically wood fiber and chemicals so it is like using sawdust to make wood, it will adhere to itself and can be layered in to build it up, kinda like using wood filler to replace a missing piece in a wood cabinet. Again begin sanding the area and the NEW bakelite will set up so fast it will amaze you and you can build up missing area very fast and blend them in after with a 2000 grit fine sanding paper and polish it out to hide the repair very well. Much stronger than epoxy weakened with cocoa or other colorants. <P>Of course if you are going to repaint the resulting repairs the best and fastest filler is automotive or marine grade Epoxy putty which comes with metal filler for strength, is available in a copper brown color, works like magic, hardens fast, can be drilled, sanded, filed, or painted and is invisible when painted over if you are careful with your sanding and primering before repainting. <P>One caution with all these techniques is WEAR RUBBER GLOVES! This keeps the super glue you are sanding from becoming part of your fingers instead of part of your radios. Also do NOT inhale the fumes from the process or get the fumes in your eyes as it can blind you! Outdoors is best or indoors with a fan PULLING the air away from your work area. <P>Experiment with this method on a scrap cabinet and be amazed at what you can do with a little practice! Also, I've done this for 13 years so I know it works and my radios repaired this way have never broken again without the use of any inside fiberglass or other surface buildups needed, it simply looks and feels like bakelite when you are done with only minor surface differences after polishing it out.<P>I still recommend this for sets you are planning to repaint primarily though as even if you did well you will still mentally know where the breaks were and it will bug you to no end that it isn't "perfect". I keep in mind though, "that which is perfect has not yet come..." but I'm watching for it!<P>Experiment, enjoy, exfoliate!<P>------------------<BR>DecotronixDan


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